The Fear

[BovaryX]

Reading recent threads, I am struck by how many people appear frightened about the repercussions of expressing GC opinions on social media. My question is this:

A) Does fear influence what you debate and how you debate it?
B) Do you think fear is being deliberately used as a tactic to silence dissent?
C) And if you answer yes to A) and B), what would make you feel less fearful?

The idea has always been to frame a massive cultural change as a de facto fait accompli realisation of the true natural order of things and to sweep away past paradigms as rapidly as possible.

This is so well written, thank you Dervel. It really sums up all of the gaslighting that is going on, where we are suddenly told that science is 'wrong, bigoted, a hate crime' etc and how there is this complete denial about sex, how about sex is binary, about how sexuality works, and about how society has been set up for centuries. They act like their views are the norm when in fact most of their views are based on queer theory, which is often the inverse of the accepted for centuries norm.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3541908-Regulatory-capture?pg=1
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3613391-The-Equalities-and-Human-Rights-Commission-one-of-the-roots-of-regulatory-capture
threadreaderapp.com/thread/1126466517082804224.html

This one is the most chilling
uncommongroundmedia.com/police-uk-trans-issues/

MrsSnippy,
Thank you for those links, appreciated.

A) yes both online and in person becasue I've had some horrible things said about me because of being GC, and I'm scared it bars me from some things I used to enjoy because they are very woke environments.
B) Absolutely. It's the modern scold's bridle.

C) seeing politicians, agencies and the police reject any suggestion that being GC is 'hate" and needs to be pilloried

Absolutely. It's the modern scold's bridle

It’s interesting, isn’t it? Misogyny seems to be once more resurgent.

Perhaps a fear of a different sort here.

We know all too many young girls who have transitioned, including one in the wider family who has had a double mastectomy and broken her voice by using testosterone. I am very afraid that at some point, now that she has done irreparable harm to her body, she will start to realise that this is a house of cards.

I also know a young girl (17) who has transitioned, had a double mastectomy, and is on testosterone.

to sweep away past paradigms as rapidly as possible.

Like Mao's Cultural Revolution.

It’s not just MPs and legal entities or police who are misrepresenting the law and the context in which women’s rights were forged.

I work closely with public sector and every day I see the civil service, nhs, public institutions, local authorities and delivery agencies all cut and pasting the same policies and action plans. The same priorities and conditions being repeated with no question or critical thinking.

So funding, support, public services, priorities and money are triaged immediately away from anything GC.

I work in education and with charities, so I’m terrified that any comment I wrote on fb will impact my employability. I’m also aware that friends and family members see my comments and my opinions as being transphobic ad hateful. I know I would have had a similar reaction before thinking it all through. It’s really hard; I desperately want to stand up for women’s rights, but find online conflict and abuse really tough. I also don’t want to cause a rift in my extended family. A cousin has openly criticised gender critical views (whilst regularly posting about how her daughters will not be expected to conform to female stereotypes) and I know she will judge me badly when she finds out my views.

Yes and yes to both questions for the reasons stated already

I do speak out in my personal life but warily depending on who I'm speaking to. Never put anything on social media. Sometimes at work but not openly - more like hushed conversations with like minded individuals.
I'd like politicians to speak up.

My fear is specific to the fact that I have a close transwoman friend. I am frightened of losing her friendship. I'm pretty sure that she would take any challenge to the ideology as an extremely serious personal betrayal. I thus do not speak publicly about this topic.

However, while to an extent that is her, I think that it has absolutely been caused by what is going on at a political level. Trans people constantly get told by others, including big serious organisations like Stonewall, that anyone who challenges their beliefs in any way hates them.

And the atmosphere of terror that has been created by the endless violent threats, name calling, sackings, screams of "transphobe" at ridiculously small ideological transgressions, has meant that very few people ever dare challenge trans ideology openly. And so trans people never find out that a lot of people aren't convinced by the ideology, but still don't hate them.

It has substantially poisoned the friendship, as I now can't be honest with her. But I'm still not prepared to give it up, as she is one of the nicest people I've ever known.

Yes, our family’s trans-man is the nice kid she always was but now there’s a painful artificiality around the way she’s treated: ‘P is the best son in the world’, ‘just like his dad’, ‘luv you bro, best guy ever’ - it’s meant well but kind of reminds me of people who cover up a struggling relationship by splurging ‘love this guy soooo much!’ all over Facebook.

As an old 'women's libber' I've been really disturbed at my nervousness in speaking out about this issue. I realise that the attacks on feminists in the 60s were relatively easy to shrug off since the left at least paid lip service to supporting women's rights. The current misogyny is much harder to deal with since we've been cast as the villains, and the attacks on us are often genuinely frightening, both online and IRL.

I agree that it would be less problematic if politicians, police, civil liberties groups were willing to support women's sex-based rights - the lift to my spirits and courage when Joanna Cherry and Joan McAlpine spoke out was huge. But they are rare exceptions.

I think I just need to put on my big girl pants and go for it. The one certainty is that silence won't save us.

Yes and yes.

The vilification of Alison Bailey is an object lesson in what happens when a gender critical woman speaks out. It is hard to see this as anything other than a conscious tactic to silence dissenting views.

This silencing is a very effective tactic for getting substantive changes through. On the one hand, Stonewall says that it doesn't want to change the law providing for single sex spaces. On the other hand, it says that single sex spaces have always accommodated trans people and there have been no problems with this. These claims are blatantly untrue, but if no one is prepared to challenge them, then these radical changes become accepted practice without any need to amend the law.

So so sorry for sidelining there the thread, but tiktik how amazingly nice to see you! You will have no idea who I am but OMG your posts on breastfeeding over 14 years ago, helped me through terrible times!!

I've often wondered if you're still around!!

Politicians need to be the ones to lead this.

This is why the two prospective candidates who I know who are too afraid to speak out or support women piss me off.

One is a teacher. Who should be safeguarding anyway. They are single and don't have children. Its not good enough to hide behind saying they are scared of losing their job. They have been in their party for many years and have ambitions of being an MP and have a chance this time of that being a possibility (and the party are throwing their weight behind them)

The other doesn't have the same work responsibilities but does have personal responsibilities to their family. They won't speak out because they are particularly aware of how militant trans activists are and they have no chance of being elected.

The thing for me is, if they won't speak out, what else will they turn a blind eye to and if they don't speak out, who will?

What is the point of standing for Parliament if you only want to serve your own interests and not the interests of the public at large?

And that's why politically we are in the mess we are because increasingly only people who suck up to parties and stand out of vanity or personal ambition become MPs.

And that's why politically we are in the mess we are because increasingly only people who suck up to parties and stand out of vanity or personal ambition become MPs.

I just posted on another thread that the paucity of modern polticos is incredible to behold. They trot out tedious platitudes, capitulate to whatever is trending on Twitter and the media allows them to regurgitate nonsense without any serious challenge. Craven, self interested and integrity free seems to be in job description

Honestly I thought better of the two I know. And I know that people who know them still do.

It's disheartening to know the reality.

I want to respond before I read other opinions on this because I am sure there will be very well thought out and argued responses from more informed posters and I’ll agree with them and steal their words.

A. What to debate - no. How to debate - yes.
B. Hell, yes.
C. If we have to debate this, it should be done reasonably. Intimidation is not reasonable. No platforming is not reasonable. I feel like there is one set of rules for one group and another set for the other group. It feels very hypocritical. Let’s get rid of the hypocrisy and intimidation. The police should not be involved in sanctioning people because someone has been ‘misgendered’ or correctly sexed and had hurt feelings. Hurt feelings are not a criminal matter! Threats of violence and rape, on the other hand.....
I wish we could speak freely about this without worrying about losing friendships or jobs.