Help needed - managing stonewall in workplace

[NCsensitiveissue]

hi - I run a medium size business and have a meeting tomorrow with our LGBT champion. He’s just sent me a note with what he wants to talk about and one of the items is about paying for corporate membership of stonewall so we get access to policies to make our business trans inclusive. I don’t have a problem with trans inclusivity but I have been following the recent issues with Simon fanshawe and I have a problem with paying money to an organisation that even its founder says has lost its way and is not supporting women.

My question; how do I dodge this issue without having to run fully into a trans rights conversation? I am very happy to be supportive of trans people in our workplace but I don’t believe the stonewall approach is one I can support.

Does the business belong to you?

How do you normally deal with salesmen trying to get you to buy something you don't want and is no use to you?

I hope that there is someone here who can help you. Bumping your thread for support.

how do I dodge this issue without having to run fully into a trans rights conversation?

No. We don't have money to burn. I'm more than happy to look at specific initiatives which you think will make us a more inclusive place to work but we aren't going to pay for tokenism.

Suggest the LGB Alliance instead...

Why are they only focusing on trans? How about making your workplace lesbian-friendly.

Could you say you're aware of controversy over Stonewall and you'd like to find something equivalent instead... Other organizations or gov.uk type equality act advice instead? Be very enthusiastic but about finding a less contentious group?

Are there actually any trans members of staff? I think if not you say it's a cost the business can't justify at the moment but you will consider it and perhaps the LGBT champion can come up with some ideas of how it can be covered off without paying external advisers.

You could mention that you have been advised that some of Stonewall's training is misleading on the law, if you dare.

Look at the information which is available online, print it out and put it in a folder. Make sure you research GDPR, and the Equality Act.
At the meeting be non committal, thank them for the information and say you will look into it. You don't have to pay Stonewall to have good, inclusive policies.

Do you have resources to make a mixed sex toilet without losing the single sex or disabled toilets? What other facilities might be needed in your type of business? What is your dress code? Can you make arrangements for people who need time off for medical appointments?

This is a useful link for business;
www.hr-24.co.uk/articles/transgender-employees/

The ‘policy’ you need to adopt is the Equality Act. And it’s free, because it’s the law.

You don’t need to pay anyone to have a policy.

What HumberHellraiser said.

In your shoes, I would be quietly supportive of his plans for inclusivity but ask lots of annoying questions. I love the Socratic method!

• Which, if any, of your policies exclude trans (and also LGB) staff or clients?

The answer is probably toilets in which case you want to follow the law (Equality Act) rather than Stonewall guidance.

• Are there any other benefits to Stonewall membership other than access to their policies?

Being seen as inclusive in advertising will probably be his answer. To which your response could be - concern about Stonewall alienating LGB, consider Simon Fanshawe’s comments and LGB Alliance.

That will give him some homework to do before he tries to bring it up again. And hopefully, he will educate himself not to.

Isn’t it somewhere in the Equality Act that employers have a duty to foster good relations between those with different protected characteristics? I would go with this and say that you think the Stonewall approach is problematic in this regard.

If you run the business why did you decide to appoint an LGBT champion?

I would turn up prepared with a dossier of your own on Stonewall - particularly re recent scandals and how they have treates LGB people of late.

And maybe you could then get ahead of the curve by dividing the role into two parts at some future point: Gender Reassignment and Identity Specialist and then Lesbian, Gay and Bisexual Equality Representative. Lead the way, OP. It's your business and their rights clearly conflict.

Thank you all. To answer some questions

I don’t own the business, I just run it

There are 2 “out” and transitioned members of staff and apparently there are others in the process who don’t want to be named. But we are also a private medical business and have complaints about our service not being trans inclusive (which I assume is about forcing people to tell us their sex & use of pronouns).

We have an LGBT champion because the staff thought it was important and I am happy to support initiatives that make our staff happier. The champion is a gay man. They do lots of things for the LGB part of the acronym so I have no concerns there.

I think the PPs who suggested (a) allowing policy reviews but asking to see the policies and (b) saying that I won’t support the stonewall ask given the controversy around them + the fact there are free government resources on this is the way to go.

Thanks!

For TRAs you will be transphobic till you be remove sex altogether. I'm guessing as a medicine company you need sex in order not to get sued.
That has nothing to do with discrimination though. The Equalities and Human rights Commission have resources on gender reassignment. Check out their pages. You need to comply with the equalities act, but sounds like you are.

Interestingly the equalities and human rights commission use the phrase "sex at birth", so you could point that out if anyone has a pop.

Good luck. You'd be throwing money down the drain having anything to do with stonewall.

Suggest the LGB Alliance instead... I came to say that too. Do you also speak to women’s rights or disability groups too?

I would actually start an new board at work to cover all minority/access groups. You can’t just focus on one area of one group. The 2 transitioned staff - in what way are they ‘transitioned’? Will they ask for access to the opposite sex loo and changing areas? Do you know the laws around single sex provision?

How does stonewall help your business exactly?

In my experience - modern (often) self-appointed rainbow ‘champions’ are self centred agitating dingbats. Please don’t let them do the whole ‘rainbow and pretty colours’ in their email signature - it is very unprofessional.

Tell him/her/them/they/whatever that you wholly adhere to the Equalities Act - as it protects ALL your staff.

Yup, I think I'd stall for a while by saying let's have a look at our existing policies and see if they need strengthening, keeping everything centred around the Equalities Act – this because the language around gender can be ambiguous and confusing and focussing on equality for all is important. (They can't, surely, disagree on equality for all?)

If the request to become a Stonewall champion is pressed I'd say that I'd read an article only the other day that mentioned some kind of controversy around Stonewall and a breakaway group, so you would want to find out more before pursuing that option.

Do you let males use the female toilets at your workplace?

Where I work we get our equality and diversity training done by ACAS and they are brilliant because they understand all the issues, the law, deal with actual case work.

If I were you I'd chanel my inner Sir Humphrey, enthuse about how important all diversity is, say you want to be sure all protected characteristics are covered - race, disability, sex, gender reassignment - and you're going to look into getting ACAS in to run some courses.

Love the idea of dividing them – lesbian, gay, bi and transgender reps – and then making them part of a larger Equalities committee including all minorities, Muslim women and disabled people included.

We do have a women’s group/champion yes. I actually don’t think we have disabled group but we do hire disabled people and our policies reflect that.

Trans people are out in the sense of presenting as the other sex. (One ftm one mtf). Don’t know if they have grcs etc. Am sure we have lots of non binaries too (lots of millennials!). Suspect I’m about to find out. We also have a sizeable number of Muslim women.

The patient care issue is obviously more complex and I wouldn’t sign anything off that wasn’t approved by our chief medical officer as it has to be clinically safe.

@BarbaraStrozzi acas is a brilliant idea thanks!

The ‘policy’ you need to adopt is the Equality Act. And it’s free, because it’s the law.

You don’t need to pay anyone to have a policy.

This! With bells on! I would also discuss your concerns with those higher up in the business before they get harassed into falling down the rabbit hole. If he doesn’t his way he will go over your head. You need to take your concerns to them, in a professional manner. Point out the concerns that you have that this will impact mostly on your female staff’s right to privacy, dignity and safety. Make sure you talk about the equality act regarding rights to separate provisions for Male and female staff.