Detransitioner on 5Live this morning - massive failure of medical profession

[severnboring]

Haven't seen this posted about already - this is really worth listening to, was on about 10:30-11am. Heard it when I was out and about, will try to find link now I'm in front of computer.

It's the same man who was in Sunday Times a couple of weeks ago - he was an alcoholic, secretly crossdressed, suffered depression and anxiety. He says clearly that it is a sexual fetish and he was never a woman. He was fed into the 'affirmation' system and ended up having his genitals removed. People insisted he was a woman.

He was allowed to speak for a long time and gave a detailed account of his interactions with doctors and therapists (NHS and private). This is what happens when troubled and suffering people are sent to professionals who are either terrified to utter a dissenting word, or who have a financial interest.

It always amazes me that men with these (very real) problems are somehow something to do with me and every other woman. Despite being clear that he was a) not a woman and b) not gay, he seems to have seen women as a whole and the gay community as a whole as therapeutic services. I don't blame this on him personally - this has been pushed by the medical profession - the concept of transsexualism and how to treat it (go and 'be a woman' and see how you get on, no need to consult women about this, they're all so lovely and will be happy to mend you) and also of course by the idea of 'LGBT' - he is a straight man who frequently referred to sex with women - why is a gay club the place for him?

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0009qst

38 mins in - Peter Benjamin

In the Times: www.thetimes.co.uk/article/gender-reassignment-im-man-enough-to-admit-that-it-was-a-mistake-g2nn79j9j

Perhaps a man explicitly saying that his penis is gone and can't be put back will be taken more seriously than the 1000s of teenage girls....

Really recommend listening to the whole interview, it is incredibly damning.

he seems to have seen women as a whole and the gay community as a whole as therapeutic services. I don't blame this on him personally - this has been pushed by the medical profession - the concept of transsexualism and how to treat it ( go and 'be a woman' and see how you get on, no need to consult women about this, they're all so lovely and will be happy to mend you )

This was a bit of a lightbulb moment for me there.

If you can find a link I will listen to him later, thanks for the heads up.

go and 'be a woman' and see how you get on, no need to consult women about this, they're all so lovely and will be happy to mend you

Yes it's amazing how many men assume women's purpose and role in all this, including expecting all women athletes and their sport to merely provide a lovely validation and mental health boost experience.

LGBT - yes, the issue there is that the T has successfully re branded LGBT from having anything to do with plain sexual orientation, hence the LGB alliance. (Evil bastards, actually wanting to just focus on sexual orientation.)

Professionals are also currently living in a world where you get a storm of appalling harassment, doxing, accusations of hate crime, people getting arrested and campaigns to get you sacked if you do anything but exactly what the political lobby command. Tavistock whistle blowers have said how afraid they were to speak out when they were unhappy with what was going on. Social workers have, many have. The best interests of the person are being continually thrown under the wheels of a political agenda and people are being compelled to do it through fear.

I just re read that: I've become innured to it. This is fucking SCARY STUFF. Berlin in the bloody 30s would have recognised this kind of escalation and thinking.

It was very sad listening to that and I wish Peter peace and contentment for the future. He is brave being so open and honest about his life.

It was shocking to hear the lack of support and counselling available to him throughout this process but especially the lack of weight placed on existing MH issues. As for the transgender support counsellor (if you can describe them as such) .....

It is a step forward that this interview was on the BBC and on the whole I thought the interviewer handled it well. Not sure about the passing though I think that most women will have known he had transitioned.

However the TRA lobby will try to discount this testimony on the following a) he wasn’t really transgender b) if society had been more tolerant he would have found it easier to maintain his transition c) the church was transphobic and pressured him into detransistioning. We need to hear more of these stories and sadly I think we will.

It is shocking that he underwent all that - the thing that stands out for me is how often he kept saying 'I was drinking heavily'

It seems like there was nobody to advocate for him at any stage, someone who would have seen that there were deep psychological problems that needed addressing before he made these life changing decisions.

I agree though, the TRA lobby will only hook on to the fact that he has detransistioned because of his religion.

I agree though, the TRA lobby will only hook on to the fact that he has detransistioned because of his religion.

Yes this is probably what will happen - although he did mention religious ppl being involved in encouraging him to believe he was a woman as well. Will have to re-listen but I think he said his pastor told him 'you are a woman', and that his crossdressers group met at a vicarage.

The TRAs need to explain the system for discovering who is and who isn't trans. At the moment there is a system that can have contact with someone for years and ultimately send him to have his genitals removed without this discovery being made. This points to the need for about a billion times more 'gatekeeping' rather than getting rid of it all entirely.

@Michelle couldn't agree more. These are the fruits.

Predictably later in the program 5Live say they have been accused of transphobia. Apparently it was Peter’s fault for not telling enough to the professionals. It’s really rare, & etc. Two hours and 12 min in. Starts with a recap of Peter’s story then “the case against”

@OneEpisode - quelle surprise.

It's not the gotcha that TRAs think it is - that he withheld information -given that they are are advocating for self-ID which would invovle giving no information whatsoever.

Poor bloke. It's brave of him to speak out at such length. He has been very badly let down by the NHS.

The 'gender counsellor':
"He was putting words into my head"
"He said, 'you are a woman'"

religion rightwing terf nazi notrealtrans attentionseeking...

if he was atheist t movement still find reasons to denounce him

I think that even a lot of professionals confuse a simple fetish of cross dressing' with being transsexual. If you dress as Spock and go to conventions dosen't mean your a Vulcan.

Afraid I'm with the male and female grouping on this. You may feel like you want to be of the opposite sex but unfortunately you are what you were born, everything else is drugs and cosmetic surgery.

Peter's life is 'transphobia'. Allowing him to tell his story is 'transphobia'.

They mean heresy. Plain and simple. Any sympathy I had for this political movement is long, long gone. This is insanity.

It's not the gotcha that TRAs think it is - that he withheld information

In addition, it seems to be well known that children are being told what to say to get a diagnosis and treatment. Bet some of the activists who encourage children are the same ones who condemn detransitioners.

he seems to have seen women as a whole and the gay community as a whole as therapeutic services. I don't blame this on him personally - this has been pushed by the medical profession - the concept of transsexualism and how to treat it ( go and 'be a woman' and see how you get on, no need to consult women about this, they're all so lovely and will be happy to mend you )

This was a bit of a lightbulb moment for me there.

Me too. Thanks for articulating this, OP. It's as if womankind as a whole is being used as a therapist/mummy figure for these men. We are there to nurture their egos, nurse their boo boos and lend a sympathetic ear when the other kids in the playground are being meanies, before doling out the milk and cookies. Our failure to do so puts us in the Bad Mummy/Mommie Dearest category.

Exactly @PJs - that's what we are supposed to do for all males anyway, so it's not surprising that there's no exception here.

The idea of being transsexual comes from a time when the medical professional was completely male-dominated. They couldn't even see us.

Cross dresser or transsexual - it's just different forms of (real) distress suffered by males, there's no magic line where it crosses over into being a 'woman's issue'. There's a missing piece in the logic.

God that’s so sad

He clearly has an addictive personality and has been drawn along, seeking something. Which is unfortunately now unfixable.

This is the reality of what trans privilege activists are demanding.

Vulnerable people groomed in to irreversible and utterly pointless surgeries.

This should be banned. Completely. For everybody. It is wrong. I'm so sick of people tiptoeing around this nonsense. Humans cannot change sex. Nothing you ever do, think or say will change that. There is no 'trans'. Just damaged people not being given the mental health care they need and unethical doctors, academics, journalists getting rich off their suffering.

This is so sad, I absolutely admire his bravery for bringing forward his story though. 💪🏻 I wonder if he has a course case for medical negligence

This should be banned.

I tend to agree, but I suspect that long as we have the mantra "people can do whatever they want with their bodies and it is ok" it won't happen There needs to be a push back in the medical world against other forms of cosmetic surgery. Because really what we are saying is that you can't do these things, so invasive and dangerous, without a proportionate reason. And when a boob job or an eye lift are considered to be proportionate....

he seems to have seen women as a whole and the gay community as a whole as therapeutic services. I don't blame this on him personally - this has been pushed by the medical profession - the concept of transsexualism and how to treat it ( go and 'be a woman' and see how you get on, no need to consult women about this, they're all so lovely and will be happy to mend you )

This really is a core problem, and we see it in the transwomen who turn up here to explain to us how we ought to be facilitating their wishes all the time. Obviously part of it is just bog standard male entitlement, but there's an extra dimension of "I was promised this" with trans identified males that always makes me wonder, promised by whom? Not by me or any other women I know. The gay community was initially willing to include trans identified people who're gay because, well, they're gay, but I don't recall any promise to be a haven for unhappy heteros, it seems more like the heteros just moved in and once there were enough of them announced that it was their neighborhood now.

Where does that belief that women and gay people owe trans people free theraputic services come from? How did it start? Are actual therapists perpetuating it?

I absolutely admire Peter’s bravery and candidness about speaking publicly about what has been done to him, and irreversibly so, in the name of pursuing a political agenda. None of this fits with normal healthcare practice in the best interests of the patient as PP have said- it’s just politics and his experience really shows that. I can only imagine the shit he will now be getting from an angry TRA lobby for speaking up.
They need to acknowledge that people will detransition, that vulnerable adults are not being supported appropriately, all of that but they can’t do that, because then the whole house of cards comes tumbling down.

Instead they advocate for less safeguards- like that demedicalised NHS service pilot that was going to be provided by trans people in Manchester.

There needs to be a push back in the medical world against other forms of cosmetic surgery. Because really what we are saying is that you can't do these things, so invasive and dangerous, without a proportionate reason. And when a boob job or an eye lift are considered to be proportionate....

You're preaching to the converted Goosefoot I am opposed to unnecessary surgery generally, mostly because I had a surgical infection following minor surgery so am acutely aware that all surgery comes with a risk.

Obviously there will always be some debate as to what constitutes 'necessary' but I'm up for much tighter regulation of the cosmetic surgery industry. They're a bunch of cowboys.