very few of us know what sex we are

[greenapplesred12]

Someone just said this to me.
They said that there are numerous ways to determine someone's sex apart from chromosomes. And that there are as many genders as there are people. And, this old chestnut " sex is assigned at birth"
How do I respond to this? This person is a health professional. This person posted on a health forum where about 80-90% of other professionals were in agreement with him. Why are people buying into this stuff?

Surely no human has produced both big gametes AND small gametes?

My understanding is that a tiny number of people produce neither type of gamete but may have vestigial parts of the mechanisms to produce both. Or may for example internally have non functioning male gamete producing mechanisms but externally female looking anatomy so brought up and universally perceived as female.

Why people think this tiny number of people has any relevance to a proposal to overwrite the entire binary to the 99.999% system of sex classification with wishy washy undefined ideas of gender that fail to classify huge swathes of the population at all and appear to have no practical relevance, I don't know.

I'm confident the men who did this knew exactly what sex their victims were: www.thetimes.co.uk/article/daughters-burnt-alive-with-mother-who-failed-to-produce-son-j0bnvlhdg

And wow! Nearly 8 billion genders on the planet then. Who knew?

OP, was it a man who said this by any chance?

"And that there are as many genders as there are people."
Thereby proving that this person thinks gender = personality. Muppet.

How would I respond to this? Probably rudely/humorously, making it clear that I am not taking this ridiculous statement seriously.

'Really? Pretty sure anyone who's given birth (almost half of the world's adult population) know full well what sex they are. Pretty sure anyone with a penis (about the other half of the world's population) knows full well what sex they are. Or are you 'doing a Bill Clinton' with the word 'know'?

I'd genuinely like to know what these numerous ways to differentiate SEX are apart from chromosomes?

I'd go along with there are as many genders as there are people. Logical conclusion from there were 100 now 1000. If gender is all about what you identify as, I don't identify as any of those I feel like me. So if we've all got one each can we stop with the silly special rules based on gender that are contrary to sex-based legal protections now please?

Thereby proving that this person thinks gender = personality. Muppet.

When you look at the factors determining gender, it pretty much does = personality (clothing and appearance preferences, hobbies and desired professions, personality traits such as aggression and shyness), which is why we need to stop using it as a way to categorize people and go back to using sex as the defining characteristic when taking action to protect the rights of one sex to be safe from the danger or unfairness of the other (eg in prisons, sports, crime stats, changing facilities etc).

8bn genders you say? Oh you mean personalities sorry I thought you meant gender as in biological sex, as in male or female.

Anyone who talks like this really shouldn't be in the medical profession. I like my HCPs to know more than me and I know enough about basic biology to know that sex is binary.

See this is where we must insist on using the right language, 'gender' on its own means nothing at all when it is used like this as it's open to interpretation and that makes it a pointless word.

Honestly, you just can't have a reasonable conversation with people willing to talk such rubbish. It is the proverbial game of chess with a pigeon.

I was observed female at birth because I have a vagina. I then went through a female puberty with periods and breasts. I then went on to get pregnant, give birth, and breastfeed my babies. I'm pretty sure which biological sex I am.

I'm equally sure that my DH - having been born a penis, and with whom I conceived my children - is equally sure of his sex.

But obviously this is all so disgustingly heteronormative and we're the equivalent of nazis to be aware of this.

How does she explain how all other mammals know which sex to mate with in order to reproduce and why humans are uniquely ignorant of the skills held by rats, bats and cats, to name but three?

Well this forum has about 2 million women who thought they were women and turned out to be, er, women - uncannily impregnated by people who thought they were men and... um turned out to be men. Can you ask her if we're a large enough sample size for her?

In fact if she has any evidence of anyone born and raised female going for fertility checks only to be told 'ah shucks you're actually male' i'm sure we'd all love to hear about it.

In fact if she has any evidence of anyone born and raised female going for fertility checks only to be told 'ah shucks you're actually male' i'm sure we'd all love to hear about it.

There is one intersex condition where the person appears physically female as a child and they only realise they actually have XY chromosomes when puberty doesn't kick in properly and no periods start.

It's pretty rare, the person affected appears female and is not a fertile male.

OP, you said these confused people were “health care practitioners”. Can you be more specific? Because I would hate to think any of my medical colleagues were that ignorant of the basic physiology and anatomy they covered in first year at medical school. Ditto our nursing staff.

That's called Androgen insensitivity syndrome.

Ask him which chromosomal configuration leads to humans who menstruate and become pregnant through sexual intercourse, leading to birthing healthy babies? Because I'm pretty sure it's ONLY XX. Therefore anyone who has done all those things can be sure what her sex is.

Maybe they were this sort of HCP, Babdoc.

Maybe this individual should also read this story in today's news. A teenage girl murdered for reporting sexual harrasment by her headteacher.

www.thedailystar.net/country/nusrat-rafi-murder-ex-madrasa-principal-15-others-get-death-1818127?amp&__twitter_impression=true

Clue: victim =female
Perpetrators = male

My response would be to laugh and day "don't talk shite"

More and more, I'm persuaded this is the only reasonable reply, and also the most effective.

If these people were so stupid they thought that very few of us know what sex we are I'd be less worried than actually what's going on.

They know full well that just about every adult knows what sex they are but they are keen to pretend that this is not reality. They're doing it for ideological reasons and because either they're an enforcer of the ideology or someone who is afraid to be seen to go against it.

There is a reason there are 2 sexes, like everything in the animal world. Without which there would be no procreation.
It’s all getting beyond ridiculous

What a load of rubbish. I'm as certain as certain can be that I'm a female through and through. I've had kids and everything!

It's not getting the difference between "if" and "only if".

If a person has got XX chromosomes this doesn't mean she automatically is phenotypically "female looking" or that she is fertile.

But someone can menstruate, gestate and give birth only if she has XX chromosomes.

My vagina + menstruation since the age of 14 + pregnancy + c-section scar = no doubt at all, not even the tiniest scintilla, that I have XX chromosomes and am biologically female.

They're passionately defending their position and saying that both sex AND gender are a social construct. No, this isn't nursing/medicine, but in a profession one needs a degree to practise in, regarding the health/wellbeing of others. I'm being ambiguous to preserve anonymity. Sadly we can't have the deeply divisive opinion that biological sex is an immutable reality. Yes, we live in that world now..

Post some piss taking pictures?!

Only X chromosomes = woman

Everyone else = man

It is binary and it is that simple.

So are they saying some people who think they're female might actually be male and vice versa? Or that most of us aren't truly male or female?