Trans rights and the privilege switcharoo

[FWRLurker]

So, in intersectional feminism (the actual literal kind) the idea is that women can be further disadvantaged in patriarchy by virtue of other axes of oppression, like race, class, sexual orientation or disability.

Meanwhile of course among men these same things can put men at a disadvantage in society relative to other men. Yet men of whatever race/class/disability still hold power/privilege over women.

So genderists have managed to do two things simultaneously without people noticing - defines trans women as women and added “gender identity” to the list of other ways in which women are oppressed. By doing so they have positioned women as being privileged over males.

But surely should it not be the other way around? I would definitely be willing to say that trans women have disadvantages compared to other males - being openly gender non conforming is discriminated against, and having serious dysphoria related to ones physical body is at least analogous to a mental health issue or disability (though were not supposed to say that either). And meanwhile trans men are female and deal with these issues while most women do not.

Wouldn’t it be far more sensible and honestly fix this whole situation if we repositioned trans women as less privileged relative to other males, and trans men as less privileged relative to other females (at least to the extent they do not pass as women/men respectively)? There is then still recognition that gender expression/ID could be protected, but also that sex is ultimately the basis of women’s oppression.

I honestly think this whole thing was a planned and cynical ploy from the academic postmodernists. An intentional “switcharoo” that happened about the time some trans women started claiming to be “female” and intentional conflation of gender with sex.

I'm not an expert on this part of sociological theory but my impression is that the 'single scale of oppression' version of intersectionality is a ridiculous bastardisation of what was an interesting point about how different oppressions and stereotypes interact.

I think that the original version was pointing out that while US white women are oppressed by stereotypes of frailty, black women are not, they are expected to be strong. Thus just taking aim at the frailty stereotypes can miss how black women experience sexism, which is quite different.

That is quite different from the "let's add up a set of points and decide who is the most hard done by, and only allow those people to speak" which I think is both idiotic and dangerous

This is why I refuse “cis”, Lurker. The ludicrous claim that “cis privilege” means that women have the advantage over male transitioners.

I’m sure this positioning exercise is one of the reasons for the insistence that male transitioners are women. Because it’s obvious to anyone who knows that you can’t change sex, that sexism still applies in any case where the male transitioner is still visibly or audibly male.

Then of course, the real comparison should be women and transguys. But there’s the testosterone complication there. Transguys get a degree of male privilege if they pass, even if it’s only the deepening of the voice.

So it’s a deeply complicated picture overall.

I don't have a background in sociology but I do work with statistics and agree completely with you. As far as I understand, intersectionality is about the influences different types of oppression have on one another. It isn't just totting up how many oppression points you can find to "out-victim," other people and gain a platform on that basis. I think the biggest problem is taking the idea of privilege from a group level analysis to an individual level.

Male people demonstrating very male behaviours may have it easier than GNC males (inc TW, feminine men, gay men..) as a group but you cannot say everyone from the former group is luckier than everyone from the second. That angers (quite rightly) men who are poor, disabled, black, old...

The problem is that people are so self absorbed that they like to analyse their own lack of privilege, it allows them to blame everyone else and take no responsibility. Very few people look down from their vantage points, fighting the battles where they are currently the winners. A lot of people feel hard done by* without being able to articulate why, this oppression talk really appeals to them.

*i think this is a lack of perspective, age, upbringing etc.