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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Breaking. https://www.lifesitenews.com/mobile/news/breaking-jury-rules-against-dad-trying-to-save-his-7-year-old-from-gender-transition

95 replies

Kiwiwiwiwi · 22/10/2019 00:33

Ominous. A resounding loss. It's madness.
Hope dad can take it further.

www.lifesitenews.com/

OP posts:
jay55 · 22/10/2019 13:47

A seven year old can not consent to losing their fertility, hell I doubt they have any idea what puberty is yet. Court sanctioned child abuse.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 22/10/2019 14:26

In cases like this it would be interesting to let the child stay with a ‘neutral party’ to see if they are trying to please one parent (be on ‘team mom’), piss off another parent (‘mom says all men are bad and I’m good’) or being coerced with attention and rewards.

Why not let them ‘live as a child’ and not a pawn or experiment?

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 22/10/2019 15:29

I see there is a petition to try to stop this case. Can we post petition links?

ArnoldWhatshisknickers · 22/10/2019 16:11

the Mum needs to check in on how Jazz Jennings is doing now, not so good I hear

I very much doubt she cares. She's getting attention. She's getting her own back on her ex. She's getting 'professional' plaudits from jurors who are probably not very well informed. It's all about her, the adult, not her son and the adult he has the basic human right to become uninterupted by puberty blockers, artificial wrong sex hormones or life limiting cosmetic surgeries.

I'm glad I have never met one of these parents in real life. I'm not sure I'd be able to contain my anger.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 22/10/2019 16:12

She may even be looking to specialise in this area of medicine, who knows?

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 22/10/2019 19:17

I was struck by some points in the news report I linked to above:

  1. They had IVF and instructed the clinic they wanted boy twins. Isn't sex selection illegal here? I hope it would be. I'm surprised to hear it's legal in the US.
  1. There is a longstanding tradition in the father's family that boys get names that give them the initials JDY. Both boys were named in accordance with this tradition. I wonder if the tradition was so important to him that he pushed for boys. Pure speculation on my part, I must stress. But if I'm right, I wonder if the mother felt she'd been deprived of the chance to have a daughter. I have often wondered that about SG.
  1. They were both members of the Orthodox church at the time of the twins' birth. Implication from use of the past tense is that at least one of them isn't now. I don't know the view of the Orthodox church on gender issues.
StrangeLookingParasite · 22/10/2019 19:34

Which Orthodox was it?

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 22/10/2019 19:40

Not stated, but Georgulas (mother's name) sounds Greek to me.

Hawkinsxmaslights · 22/10/2019 19:47

Muchausen by Proxy 100%. Is no one in the medical profession not educated on these conditions now days?

kesstrel · 22/10/2019 19:52

Fekko and kesstrel You are wrong. If you know anything about evangelical Christians you would know that they believe God doesn’t make mistakes and wouldn’t mistakenly produce a girl in a boy’s body.

Texas doesn't have "evangelical Christians" in the English meaning of that term. Like all of America, it has large numbers of different Christian denominations, all of whom have variations on theology. And large numbers of people who would call themselves Christians actually know very little about the theological views of their churches anyway. And even those who believe nominally that "god doesn't make mistakes" don't stop going to the doctor, or seeing a psychologist to put those non-mistakes right if they possibly can.

Goosefoot · 22/10/2019 20:00

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g

You are probably correct somewhat about the Quakers. They are in many ways like the Episcopalians/CofE - it's a real debate in some Quaker circles whether you need to be a Christian to be a Quaker. My aunt always says of Christian groups like this "they aren't against anything but bottled water."

I'd quibble somewhat with your characterisation of the history of the church as being simplistic, there has been a lot more room for women that you suggest, and women were mothers or celibate mainly because not being celibate tended to make them mothers.

Goosefoot · 22/10/2019 20:03

If they are Greek Orthodox , or any Eastern Orthodox, the whole born in the wrong body thing would be a definite no. I'd have thought IFV would be a hard no too.

kesstrel · 22/10/2019 20:31

My comment was related to why some of the jurors might have been open to the trans argument (as opposed to the view promoted by the Christian website in the OP's link), just to clarify.

As for the parents, didn't one article say that one parent was no longer a member of the church?

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 22/10/2019 21:45

I worked for the church - not a fundamentalist one but I met all sorts in my time.

People will justify their own ideas by saying ‘god did this - he has a plan’ - so no mistakes but ‘His mysterious ways’. We don’t question.

ArnoldWhatshisknickers · 22/10/2019 21:57

I most strongly associate Texas with the Southern Baptist version of Christianity but now I think about it I'm not sure why.

Some strands of Protestantism also allow a wide degree of variability from congregation to congregation so in terms of jurors, even if every one is Christian, there would probably be a range of views on the acceptability of 'transing' as opposed to homosexuality.

ArnoldWhatshisknickers · 22/10/2019 22:15

According to Pew Baptists are the largest Protestant denomination, though Roam Catholics (who are outnumbered roughly 2 to 1 by Protestants) are the single largest denomination.

www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/state/texas/

Sorry, I know this is irrelevant but had to check if I was imagining it.

AugustL · 23/10/2019 05:34

"They were both members of the Orthodox church at the time of the twins' birth. Implication from use of the past tense is that at least one of them isn't now"

The dad is Orthodox according to Orthodox people on Twitter

Oliversmumsarmy · 23/10/2019 05:55

If the mother is a doctor and she is having this little boy transitioned because he liked the film frozen or picked a “girls “ toy and she has strict Male and female guidelines. then surely she needs to transition herself.

Being a Doctor is after all a Male profession so doesn’t that mean she is really a man in a woman’s body

JoeGargery · 23/10/2019 06:08

Gasp0de yes, sex selection is illegal here but legal in the US, both for embryo selection and termination.

slipperywhensparticus · 23/10/2019 06:11

Why does he have less rights than her?

And why the hell are they trying to transition a seven year old boy he sounds like he needs a neutral person to stay with

AugustL · 23/10/2019 06:57

"They were both members of the Orthodox church at the time of the twins' birth. Implication from use of the past tense is that at least one of them isn't now"

The dad is Orthodox according to Orthodox people on Twitter"

And that's an Orthodox Christian symbol on the boys t shirt in the photo with his dad www.lifesitenews.com/mobile/news/breaking-jury-rules-against-dad-trying-to-save-his-7-year-old-from-gender-transition

"Before this case, Dr. Georgulas had complete authority over psychological care decisions for the boys. She was required to inform Mr. Younger of her decisions, but he did not have any say in her choice of care. "

  • does this mean she was his Dr and made decisions over this medical care? Shouldn't it be someone independent? Or do they just "affirm" in the U.S. anyway ? Do they think a McDonald's "girl toy" or Frozen dress is reason to transition a kid like apparently this mother thinks.

www.lifesitenews.com/news/mom-trying-to-transition-son-to-girl-i-suspected-he-was-trans-when-he-preferred-girl-mcdonalds-toy

"TEXAS, October 18, 2019 (LifeSiteNews) – The mother who is trying to “transition” her seven-year-old son to a girl testified today that she began to believe her child was different when he preferred a McDonald’s girl toy to a boy toy.

Jefferey Younger and Dr. Anne Georgulas are in a custody and conservatorship battle over their twin sons, James and Jude. James presents as a girl called “Luna” at his mother’s home and as a boy with his father. Georgulas has enrolled James in school as a girl since kindergarten. Mr. Younger alleges Dr. Georgulas is forcing James to present as a girl. He is worried about James undergoing chemical castration or a full medical “transition.”

Today was meant to be the final day of the trial, which is being heard by a jury, the trial was recessed before noon and will resume Monday morning. The judge ruled the trial must end by Monday at 2:00 p.m.

A variety of expert witnesses from both sides have testified.

Dr. Georgulas testified this morning. She reiterated her desire to keep the media out of the case, allegedly in order to protect the privacy of her boys. Earlier in the week, the custody evaluator mentioned what he said was significant harm done to Georgulas’ pediatric practice because of the case’s publicity.

Additionally, Georgulas told the jury about the events leading up to James’ presentation as “Luna.”

She told the jury that she first started to think something may be different with James when he selected a girl’s toy at McDonalds.

“So the very first thing I saw was in the summer of 2015 when she [James] picked a McDonald’s girls’ toy instead of a boys’ toy.”

Dr. Georgulas then recounted a story of taking James to get a crown at Target. James told his mom an Elsa dress, from the popular Frozen franchise, “was such a pretty dress.”

“I asked him, ‘Do you want the dress?’ and she [sic] replied, ‘Yes!’” Dr. Georgulas said, so she purchased the dress for James and allowed him to wear it at home
According to Dr. Georgulas’ testimony, James then asked insistently for a dress on two occasions. The third time James asked for a dress, Dr. Georgulas alleges that he said, “I want that dress and I don’t want it to be pretend.”

Dr. Georgulas also showed photos of James in a dress at her father’s house to show that James was comfortable presenting as a girl with his father. Mr. Younger testified to the same fact the previous day. Dr. Georgulas believes James presents as a boy at his father’s home now due to his father’s lack of acceptance of James as “Luna.” Mr. Younger shared with the court that at one point James threw away the girls clothes James had at Mr. Younger’s home.

Dr. Georgulas stated that the fact that “Mr. Younger surrounds himself with people like that [who do not affirm ‘Luna’s gender’]” is concerning.

Mr. Odeneal, Mr. Younger lawyer reviewed Dr. Georgulas’ previous deposition with her while she was on the stand.

According to Dr. Georgulas’ deposition, when asked about starting James on puberty blockers she responded, “That is the recommendation. That what GENECIS suggest, that’s what she’s [James] talking about, but that would only be if she persists.”

The trial continues on Monday."

I wonder if it's possible to get the full court documents?

Oliversmumsarmy · 23/10/2019 07:33

A paediatric doctor.

How can she be a paediatric doctor when she doesn’t appear to know the first thing about children.

AugustL · 23/10/2019 07:36

Don't some scientists think that puberty is needed to, for lack of better phrase - correct things - for some children who think they're trans? The effects the hormones have in the brain? And if they are on puberty blockers they don't get this and so likely to carry on to cross-sex hormones?

Anyway, this case seems to revolve around gender stereotypes about toys and clothes though if reporting is correct. Not dysphoric distress or discomfort with the sex of their body.

emerencemaybehopeful · 23/10/2019 07:41

Those saying that christians are different to Muslims and that there isn't the same cultural need to embrace the trans narrative have missed a lot of what seems to be happening in the US.

There has been research on this specifically, and a lot of the B&S videos of little boys who love dresses and are finally allowed to put flowers in hair, and similar of little girls having their hair cut boy-style include references to Jesus.

The article linked a few times up above is surprisingly balanced, which means I'm certain it's a source that I should know is right wing and terrible.

Did anyone else notice that the mother almost seems more upset that the publicity might affect her professional reputation than about her child's health?

lionheart · 23/10/2019 08:23

lukemacias.com/afathersfight/