Help please on responce from letter sent to governing body of my sport re rules on transwomen playing alongside and in opposition

[AvengingAngel]

Hi,

So after playing a friendly football tournament where the other team fielded a trans women and now having first hand experience of it being unfair/dangerous and a clear advantage to the opposition. I've raised the issue of how my sports club of another league team sport I play would manage trans women wishing to play.

I set out a number of concerns which they forwarded to the governing body of the sport. and have had a response. The overall jist of what I received from the governing body of my main sport was tough luck, we want to be inclusive and trans women are fine to play.

I do not want to post the email chain and response publicly, but if anyone would be kind enough to help me respond to their email via PM I would be really grateful.

But sport IS inclusive of transwomen. Anyone with a male body can play against others with male bodies. As happened in the recent Kent cricket case where the transwoman was playing in male and female teams at the same time. This policy means that a woman has been excluded from the women’s team to make way for someone with a male body who can and should be playing with other male bodied people. The inclusivity argument is quite specious. The men’s team should be looking for ways to include transwomen in their team.

Honestly, I'm fuming. We have as young as 13 year old (small) girls who are expected to play against fully grown TW. They will get injured. Ug.

But I suppose their argument is that the TW doesn't want to play in the mens team because they aren't men. Right?

Lots of resources here

fairplayforwomen.com/

Thanks Olga. That's a fab resource!

If you Google "Karolinska Institute transwomen muscle mass" (sorry on phone so can't do links) it will throw up recent research from August this year showing that transwomen may lose strength relative to other people who share their male biology (formerly known as men) but that doesn't reduce their strength to the female range,

@BarbaraStrozzi the governing body aren't actually denying TW have a physical advantage. They are saying the physical advantage doesn't matter.

Ask them to get their insurers to confirm that they will be covered for the additional risk?

Posted too soon - may be useful in framing a reply to their reply.

Fairness and inclusion matter, but inclusion is best dealt with by campaigning for men's teams to be more inclusive of gender non conforming individuals (you might want to reference Jaiyah Saelua who used to play international men's football for American Samoa).

You cannot include male bodied individuals on women's teams and have fair sport for women.

It will get to the point where a field of transwomen play women’s football with another team of transwomen. At that point maybe someone will notice.

@needmoresleep Huh. Yes, that's an interesting take as they are shit hot on everyone being insured, because its a dangerous sport. At club level or nation governing body level do you think?

@sheshoots it was suggested to me I can stop playing competitive sports if I wanted to make a point.

@BarbaraStrozzi yup. I like turning it on its head and I will certainly include that in my response, but what about that TW want to play on female teams and not male teams?

Ask for the risk assessments and insurance details, ask about changing facilities and how they will treat a female team member who complains about sharing and how they might support a rape victim in a sharing a female space with a man.

Selina Soule is Connecticut is fighting this with support in the US but one big factor in her argument is the scholarships.

Women and girls need space in sports to compete individually and in teams. You might need to gain support from others but I hope you can challenge this. We need to challenge it every single time it happens. We cannot let it go, we haven't had it for very long and whilst coverage and investment has improved for the World Cup for women (I refer to it in the same way for men now. If someone says "the World Cup" I ask which one they mean ) it is community teams and community sport that got women there.

Well my answer (and I guess yours) is that sport is about fair competition between biologically matched individuals, not about validation.

That won't fly with them I guess. Ask them if they'd be okay with the situation described upthread, where two teams of transwomen play against each other?

I presume this is the FA. What level? Regional? National? Maybe include that photo of the Saudi women's football team and ask whether they'd be happy for the Lionesses to go up against them?

What do the members of your team think?
They probably aren't all ok with it. Can you get some if the other team players to write in as well?

Sorry, Iran, not Saudi Arabia

@ohholyjesus thanks for that.

The Governing body are waiting for the guidance from Sport England re changing rooms who are currently writing them.

The gov body have completed risk assessments and I will ask to see those.

And yes I like the insurance idea. Actually, if the insurance company won't cover them then that will throw the cat among the pigeons for sure.

I really dont know. My guess is that the Club will get their insurance via the National Body.

However if enough clubs/umpires contact them for clarification, as they are concerned that talented 13 year old are getting folded like deckchairs, the National body might, just might, engage some common sense.

A more likely outcome is that talented youngsters (and DD played a sport where talented youngsters destined for better things would start playing with seniors at 13) will not want to move up and progress. And other juniors wont want to play with transgirls.

But for some completely incomprehensible reason, sport, like education, health and a load of other sectors is prepared to ignore women's needs and safety for the sake of a few thin skinned men.

@BarbaraStrozzi this sport isn't football. I played football against a TW and it made me really think about my other sport I play which imo is far more dangerous than football.

I will include the Iranian team though as a reference point. Thanks.

This is at county level.

@qcng I've spoken to one other person in the squad and she agrees with me, this is an issue. The committee member I spoke to to raise my concerns also agreed with me. The problem is, everyone is terrified of being accused of transphobia.

Biological males who identify as transgender women are wreaking havoc in women’s rugby in Great Britain.

Women’s rugby referees in England are quitting their jobs over the inclusion of the male athletes, according to a report in The Sunday Times this weekend.

Trans player, Kelly Morgan, is laying waste to female players and "folded a girl like a deckchair".

pluralist.com/transgender-athletes-wreak-havoc-in-womens-rugby/

Males playing any kind of contact sport against females is downright dangerous. Women have already been seriously injured.

I'm going to use those examples and photos. Thanks.

We're all at serious risk here.

Sorry,. My mistake.

Insurance is a good line to pursue. I also thought of the situation with rugby referees quitting. In rugby the ref is responsible for ensuring safety on the pitch (insofar as that is possible), and not surprisingly they're not prepared to referee matches with 6'2", 15 stone male bodied individuals in the front row of the scrum against women in the opposing line - because they don't want a woman paralysed from the neck down on their conscience for the rest of their lives.

@BarbaraStrozzi Amen. And not only women in my case, but natal female children.

I would speak closely with your team members and coaches. Put up a United front so it's not just you speaking up alone and being put at risk of being called names and possibly being asked to leave.

Go to the governing body with back up, eg a signed letter/email from many signatories.