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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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21 replies

Boobiliboobiliboo · 10/09/2019 16:10

I’ve been sent a draft national survey for NHS staff. The monitoring questions (mandatory Hmm) include gender (not sex) and “do you identify as trans?”

I feel strongly about this, but am exposed professionally. What’s the best way for me to get the point across (re gender being construct, not being a protected characteristic etc) without causing offence to others (one of whom has transitioned FTM and has a GRC)?

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truthisarevolutionaryact · 10/09/2019 16:14

Maybe challenge on the basis of the protected characteristics - sex being one of them plus gender reassignment? That's objective and accurate?

bluebluezoo · 10/09/2019 16:18

I’d put genderfree.

It’s true. I don’t “feel” like a woman. I don’t like make up, dresses, heels, manicures and prosecco. I don’t feel like a man though either, although I do like trousers, sport, and science, and don't shave body hair.

So gender free it is.

Babdoc · 10/09/2019 16:21

Can you just cross out gender and write sex? Or write that you don’t accept gender stereotypes?
The answer to the trans question is just No, presumably?

Boobiliboobiliboo · 10/09/2019 16:23

Sorry. Wasn’t clear. I’m being asked to professionally comment on the draft, not to answer it.

I don’t think gender should be captured and I don’t think the trans question should be there at all.

It’s online so no option to cross anything out.

This will go out to thousands of staff, so I don’t want to just wave it through, but am exposed professionally within a wide group of woke folk!

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Nappyvalley15 · 10/09/2019 16:30

Could you suggest they change 'gender' to sex and still ask the trans question?

ErrolTheDragon · 10/09/2019 16:32

What is the purpose of the survey? What's the specific need for those two questions; is 'gender' intended as a euphemism for the protected characteristic 'sex', if so then sex should be used to avoid ambiguity. If not, clarification is needed as the term 'gender' is not uniformly understood (even the dictionary definition isn't very clear).

Boobiliboobiliboo · 10/09/2019 16:33

Good thinking.

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Boobiliboobiliboo · 10/09/2019 16:34

It’s a wellbeing survey.

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ErrolTheDragon · 10/09/2019 16:45

Oh, if it's a well-being survey you might point out that there's evidence of a link between sex discrimination and depression in women.

And that issues around pregnancy, combining work with caring for children etc may have particular impact on women's well being so it's important to capture the biological sex data corrrectly.

ErrolTheDragon · 10/09/2019 16:46

Meant to link to thread about the depression research

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3687392-sex-discrimination-linked-to-depression-in-women?reverse=1

Kit19 · 10/09/2019 16:55

I assume these are monitoring questions that also include things like race & disability? I would sweetly reply that it is important to be sure that its in line with the equalities act and that it’s important to separate out sex from gender to ensure accuracy of data

I might also ask them to include a definition of what they mean by “trans” obviously to ensure no one is missed out by not realising they were trans right ;) If they go with the stonewall definition I reckon you could covertly peak trans a looot of people!

BarbaraStrozzi · 10/09/2019 16:55

In terms of protecting yourself professionally, keep bringing it back to the protected characteristics under the EA. Then point out the many ways biological sex links with well being, whether directly (PND etc) or via social attitudes and sexism.

thirdfiddle · 10/09/2019 19:34

I would suggest they ask for sex (m/f/prefer not to say tick box) and gender of current identification (free text). And they should define both so people know what they mean.
At very least I think sex should be in there above gender, sex is the protected characteristic.

YobaOljazUwaque · 10/09/2019 19:46

I have no problem with filling in forms that are worded "How would you describe your Gender?" So long as there is an "other" option.

I typically tick Other and complete it as:
"I would describe gender as a regressive set of sexist stereotypes that people are expected to conform to. I reject it and so have no gender. My sex is female."

If you can push for a wording like this then I am happy enough

You may need to query how the organisation will monitor their obligations to provide equal opportunities on the protected characteristic of sex given that you aren't collecting that info, but that is a separate question.

Barracker · 10/09/2019 19:54

Boobiliboobiliboo

The NHS has clearly defined the difference in data capture for sex and gender, and the importance of not conflating the two.

You can use their own documentation against them, including their very specific definitions of how sex and gender are different.

You can also remind them that they are legally obligated to monitor SEX as it is a protected characteristic in the EA2010, and if they neglect to capture sex data they expose themselves to risk of legal challenge that they are failing to uphold their obligations under that act.

Gender will not suffice, as they have already declared that gender is not sex, therefore they will not be able to defend the conflation of the protected characteristic sex, with a self declared subjective 'gender' which is not a protected characteristic.

medium.com/@anneharperwright/sex-gender-the-nhs-bb86b0c3ebb

ThePurported · 10/09/2019 20:13

^What Barracker said.

They can't use the survey for equality monitoring purposes unless they collect data on sex.
NHS own guidelines for clinical applications state that both sex and gender should be recorded since 'gender' is too ambiguous and therefore not safe (see Barracker's link). Shouldn't they apply this same policy to staff wellbeing surveys?

Gizmo79 · 10/09/2019 20:17

But the nhs allows a trans woman to be on a gynae ward if they declare themselves to be female. The NHS does not care about females anymore.

Creepster · 10/09/2019 20:58

Replacing sex with gender is like replacing modern medicine with hopes and prayer. We are entitled to do it to ourselves but the NHS imposing it on us is inexcusable.

Boobiliboobiliboo · 10/09/2019 21:00

It’s not NHS England. Not sure if that makes a difference.

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ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 10/09/2019 21:10

I echo what others have said -

Both sex and gender reassignment are protected characteristics. It is important collect data on both of these. If the sex question is "gender" then it risks confusing both the sex and the gender reassignment figures.

stumbledin · 11/09/2019 00:34

AS a service provider surely the NHS has to ask a question about sex. As others have said they need this for Equality Monitoring and service provision.

I would suggest the option put forward up thread.

Qestion on Sex: Male / Female / Intersex / Prefer not to say

Question on Gender Identity? Do you have one if yes please describe.

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