Disconnect between all the trans stuff and the public's view

[StealthPolarBear]

Bear with me, long and rambling.
When society has changed in the past, most recently on gay marriage I think, most people knew it was going on and it was broadly supported, although I'm sure there were a sizeable majority that opposed it for various reasons.
This trans stuff and the concept of gender fluidity isn't even on most people's radar. The vast majority of people believe (as do I) that you're male or female. Most believe men can wear dresses and boys can play with dolls and that girls can climb trees and get muddy. But that on the whole boys are boys and girla are girls. So where is this huge wave of trans issues and trans policies and changes coming from? And why does no one actually seem to notice or comment?

I noticed the trans woman speaking out in favour of the removal of sex restrictions from Hampstead Ponds on BBC local news was Reverend Christina Beardsley who is not only harmlessly middle-aged looking but is also a vicar. As she spoke tremulously of her desire to just to be able to swim, whose heart could remain hardened! What harm could it do?
It's a lot like vaccination - decades of vaccines have ensured that hardly any of us - in the wealthy West, at least - have experienced the real harm that diseases can inflict; the result is that some believe we can do without vaccination altogether, even that vaccination itself is harmful.
So it is with the self-ID issue. We've spent decades peacefully co-existing with lovely harmless transwomen like the Rev Beardsley. So, when the idea of gender self-ID comes along, most people think it's a great idea that will help all those lovely trans people - "Where's the harm?"

People largely believe that common sense and general rules of civilised society will apply. So on that implied basis of understanding it's pretty easy to say "yeah, live and let live" and all the rest of it.

But they don't.

And the reality is so staggeringly batshit it doesn't even sound plausible, so people don't think the truth is true.

That's how I feel. I read about it on here but where I live and the surrounding cities/towns, it's not even in question that a boy is a boy and a girl is a girl. The people round here would laugh at all the self ID thinking it's a prank.

ILikeYourHairyHands
Excellent analysis. I agree completely. And because this ideology upholds men’s rights to view women and children as objects it will be enforced.

There's also the way trans woman are portrayed in the media. Most people still think of trans people as the traditional more effeminate transsexual orientated towards men and so no threat to women

Yep. They usually use post op ones as well which make up around 10% population.

People were already heavily policed as to what they could and could not say in the workplace, and the trans issue is just another extension of that.

This is key. Especially for those employed in the public sector. There has been a requirement to blindly toe the party line with regard to all equality issues.

It doesn't mean everyone believes it.

I have concerns that the diverse-at-all-costs-approach to adopting vulnerable children isn't always quite as marvellous as it is presented to be. I'd risk being sacked if I voiced those concerns out loud.

I think it may be because taken individually, different parts of the trans movement sound quite reasonable.

• Transwoman in toilets- where else would they go?

-Transgirls in Guides- how lovely they are being included -Transwoman in sport- sounds inclusive -Transwoman in shelters- they are victims of abuse too And it can be easy to forget the impact it can have until it all adds up into one large movement where woman becomes meaningless

i think as well insofar as the public are aware, they think that transwomen are men who have had surgery, taken hormones, and just want to live peacefully and quietly as a woman. all the push back from women is therefore seen as being cruel and spiteful to people who are doing their best to manage a difficult situation.

once you show them the Phillip Bunces of this world let alone the Karen Whites, most people are immediately wtf? but not enough people know about them or think it's far too ridiculous to be true

@hairyhands I apologise for calling you hairylegs in my post above! What was I thinking!

BuzzShitbagBobbly agree

I genuinely think the majority of people don’t know what’s going on
I’m hoping they will be horrified when they find out

I’m used to knowing about it and I find the language incredibly confusing
I wonder if some people are supporting certain things without understanding what they are tbh.

I think the politicians, corporations, media, and other influencers/decision makers are desperate to be “on the right side of history” and show how they are so unprejudiced and down with the kids, so have adopted trans ideology wholesale.

They also haven’t realised that - unlike accepting homosexuality - accepting trans activists’ ideology is harmful, as it massively reinforces gender stereotypes and, in some aspects, tramples all over female rights.

Meanwhile the great majority of the public has no idea this is going on. They know about transsexuals but they have no idea about the proposed legislative changes or the lobby groups or the medicating children or the enormous rise in teens and pre teens declaring themselves trans. They haven’t really thought about the gender stereotype reinforcement or impact on women’s rights. Hence the live and let live philosophy (insofar as they have thought about it at all).

*I think it may be because taken individually, different parts of the trans movement sound quite reasonable.

• Transwoman in toilets- where else would they go?

-Transgirls in Guides- how lovely they are being included -Transwoman in sport- sounds inclusive -Transwoman in shelters- they are victims of abuse too And it can be easy to forget the impact it can have until it all adds up into one large movement where woman becomes meaningless*

It's also back to the obfuscation of language again. Replace all those terms with men and boys and it suddenly looks a lot less reasonable.

Hence why a bat signal goes out on the language threads. Whoever controls the language controls the narrative. Propaganda 101.

Ova such a good point to link with those individual issues

I honestly think people hear the words and don’t know the meaning, otherwise they would all ring alarm bells.

I think most people don't really understand what is going on. They either think its a medical/psychological thing, or they think it's a kind of euphemistic way of speaking. If they hear really crazy stuff, they think it must be untrue or smart people would not believe it.

Many also have a very inflated understanding of the science. They read NG or something they think is reputable and assume the science element is really solid. I don't know how many people have told me such and such is the accepted medical standard. Most people aren't in a real position to look into every little thing themselves and many aren't able to read medical literature.

But I agree with the language control, especially in the workplace. We've created a culture where tolerance is one of the only real ethical values we teach, and being a bigot one of the few sins.

Maybe most of all, the population has been trained to accept all kinds of slogans and soundbites that are being leveraged now, some from feminism, some from gay rights, some from sex positivity, some from capitalism, some from identity politics. Sex is always healthy and not dangerous if it is conceptual. Love is love. Sex work is work. You get to choose and define your own identity. Your identity is essential to who you are and you must be able to express it authentically. Our physical bodies aren't important.
It's a mishmash, often slogans without understanding what they really mean, sometimes bad arguments that sound plausible, often all contradicting each other, often only applicable in one context but not in another. But people accept them all at face value and assume they work in any setting.

It should read conventual, above. Conceptual sex might not be totally safe either though.

Jeeze louize. With consent. You know.

“ Conceptual sex might not be totally safe either though”

I definitely wouldn’t worry about pregnancy from that

What’s NG please?

National Geographic

Oh, I guess that magazine is a lot different than I thought it was.

I think attaching the suffix “phobic” is a key factor here. In fact, I’d like to tell you about a chat I had with a friend on this topic but I can’t because I literally cannot figure out the word salad I’d need in order to meet guidelines.

The claim of whateverphobia in woke discourse generally is a problem. It needs to be challenged generally but it won't be.