Julie Bindel in The Sunday Times

[NotBadConsidering]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/julie-bindel-the-man-in-a-skirt-called-me-a-nazi-then-attacked-8dfwk8jft?shareToken=f19f4ec79438928b896b5208e86342d6

The comments to that article are a delight. Every one is GC to date, and many are totally on point.

I am very worried that this rhetoric, this violent, misogynistic brand of trans rights activism, may culminate in an incident such as what happened to Lee Rigby or Jo Cox - their attackers felt justified in their violence by their beliefs, just as Julie’s attacker does.

Frankly, Elliot Rodger springs to mind.

I am very worried that this rhetoric, this violent, misogynistic brand of trans rights activism, may culminate in an incident such as what happened to Lee Rigby or Jo Cox - their attackers felt justified in their violence by their beliefs, just as Julie’s attacker does.

So am I. The GC backlash is growing stronger by the day, which means that TRA fury will also grow by the day and could very well find even worse expressions that this. These brave women need to be very aware of their own safety. I worry for them.

because feminists seemed to be arguing esoteric points, using words like 'gender' that I didn't really understand, their concerns seemed to be very intellectual and removed from the reality of my life

The thing is: once you have become conscious of something; of how it operates, then you naturally start talking about 'it', or discussing it in more over-arching or theoretical terms. It goes with the territory of becoming more aware, and more informed.You reflect upon life and experience.

You live with gender expectation even if if you do not have the vocabulary to describe it in that way. You may talk about how 'unfair' or unjust something is, or how something really pisses you off.

Education can lead into some total mid-fucks ( Queer Theory and post modernism, for example), but it can also liberate and shine a light.

Mind-fucks ( correction)

It's a great article, but was spoilt a little for me by the explanation of 'cis' as 'non-trans'. We know that there's so much more to it, ideologically speaking, but the casual reader won't. It's contributing to the normalisation of a term and an idea that many women, and most feminists, utterly reject

Yes, but for the immediate purpose it will suffice. I'm sure that will be dealt with in comments - if they survive moderation.

One step at a time. Most people are pretty oblivious to any of this right now.

Sounds great, thank you Julie Bindel. Worth buying the Sunday Times for a change.

What's the (latest) difference between "trans woman" and "transwoman", please? It's getting hard to keep up!

What's the (latest) difference between "trans woman" and "transwoman", please? It's getting hard to keep up!

The way I understand it, with trans woman trans is just an adjective describing a woman, the equivalent of black woman, disabled woman, beautiful woman. It gives legitimacy to the word woman.
Transwoman a different category to woman altogether. But I think in time we should stop using that word as well.
Maybe someone else can explain it better.

I believe that many think that transwoman is insulting and they prefer trans (space) woman as they claim it is more grammatically correct.
Personally I find both insulting but my views do not evidently count.

Aspley why should your views count? You're only the old-fashioned type of woman, you didn't make the choice to be a woman, which is much more valid. Evidently.

Lamaha and Aspley, thank you. I now see the difference.

I agree that using the word "woman" in any way to describe anyone but a person who was born with a vagina is insulting. I tend to go with trans identifying male/female.

I thought in the context of that sentence the simplified 'cis means non trans' was useful as it made clear just how sinister the chanting of 'die cis scum' at the protest truly is.

Readers not familiar with the dialect of all this get the instant translation of 'die all non trans people', and get the full impact. And that is what the protesters pretty much meant.

Exactly. Julie has to explain that people are prepared to abuse her simply because she is “cis”. It’s like saying “die two-legged scum”. Ridiculous.

Cis and terf are words designed and both now only used to demean and attack women.

The comments to that article are a delight. Every one is GC to date, and many are totally on point
They didn't publish my GC comment. It was quite banal, too.

Nor mine.

Mine is there and I’m very proud and I used my real name, which is the most public thing I’ve done on this issue (aside from attend talks etc). With this incident, the anger overcame the fear and I felt emboldened enough and be publicly supportive of Julie and openly gender critical. It’s a refreshing feeling.

That's really great, Cwenthryth.

I thought in the context of that sentence the simplified 'cis means non trans' was useful as it made clear just how sinister the chanting of 'die cis scum' at the protest truly is.

Rather than ‘cis means non trans’ I’d have preferred ‘cis means almost everyone’ to drive home the point TRAs are trying to redefine the vast majority of the population with neither their knowledge nor consent.

I commented and it was up for about one minute and then they took it down. But even so... they are still GC, just not terribly radical.

Well done Julie.

I do find it discomfiting that I'm apparently more hard-line than Julie Bindel with my opinions though.

No-one can live as the opposite sex. Sex doesn't have a lifestyle that can be adopted. And the word transwoman is a misnomer that I avoid using.

I find it unusual that she's been at this business for so many years and doesn't seem to have reached the logical conclusion at the end of the journey yet.

But setting all that aside, I'm glad she is able to be heard, and very glad she wasn't hurt, and extraordinarily grateful for every aspect of her tireless work for women's rights. Actual women, of the variety that need no prefix.

I read the guardian article and thought it was surprisingly balanced. Julie also said she knew these people didn’t represent the majority of transsexuals (rather than transgender) which I thought was very interesting. It

It also said Edinburgh uni was ‘taking a break’ from the Stonewall certification scheme (can’t remember proper name).

Taking a break from the Stonewall certification is an interesting one. Most public sector orgs do everything they can to get these awards (no matter how meaningless they are). No doubt there will be much bashing of teeth from students and staff but it shouldn't make any difference. We should treat everyone with respect trans/lesbian/whatever - no one needs to pay Stonewall to achieve this.
I chose not to be out at work as it makes no difference in my ability to do my job and my private life is private, but I am also not an attention seeking victim so maybe that is where the difference lies.