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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Good explanation of US abortion law and why it is so vulnerable

4 replies

NonnyMouse1337 · 22/05/2019 14:19

Maybe people are already aware about this, but as someone living in the UK and not the US, I don't know very much about the legal side of the US abortion debate, only that it is a very volatile issue from a societal perspective.

I found these two podcasts extremely informative and would highly recommend them, because they helped me to actually understand the situation and the legal framework of how it was implemented, and why it can be overturned.
Each one is about 25 minutes long and quite easy to understand.

I was unaware that the underlying case was based on fairly tenuous interpretations of personal liberty. This makes it extremely vulnerable to being overturned at some point in the future by the Supreme Court should its judges wish to do so.

www.nytimes.com/2019/05/20/podcasts/the-daily/supreme-court-abortion.html

www.nytimes.com/2019/05/17/podcasts/the-daily/alabama-abortion-law-roe-wade.html

Quite shocking, really, to know it all rests on such a vague interpretation. It was all they had to work with at the time, so I don't fault the legal team, but I would have thought the women's rights movements in the nineties and onwards would have been conscious of its weaknesses and pushed for a much more robust law to replace it. Maybe they did but it didn't gather enough momentum - I don't know the activist history.

As much as I dislike the evangelical right, I have to admit they are on the ball. They have understood the law, understood the loopholes and actually have a long term plan to keep chipping away, coming up with inventive restrictions.
Sadly, it seems like the only thing many on the left (and I use that term quite loosely) is a social media performance of moral outrage and posting of edgy memes. It's no wonder the right keep making slow but sure gains.

It also reminded me of the value of educating ourselves on facts, laws, how our rights are implemented, what the loopholes are and whether they can be superseded with more robust frameworks.
I find many activists and socially progressive movements have a very poor understanding of economics, law etc, or at least don't seem to demonstrate this effectively to the general public. There will be marches, slogans and so on, which is not a bad thing, but very few concrete ideas on what should be done or how to effectively cement various rights so those who wish to undermine them will find it harder to do so. I guess it's easy to feel complacent until it's too late.

This is very relevant for the UK too now that we are embroiled in the gender identity issue with queer theory being pushed as if it's a mainstream idea and trans ideology is impacting on sex based rights.

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BickerinBrattle · 22/05/2019 18:28

Yes, the Roe decision was based on a very expansive reading of the Constitution and premised on the Griswold decision that permitted birth control. If Roe goes, the same arguments for overturning it will apply to Griswold.

There definitely should have been a push to amend the Civil Rights Act to include abortion rights in the 90s when the Democrats had control of both Congress and the WH. Unfortunately, that was a period of “third-way” triangulation and the Dems then allowed for pro-life positions within the Democratic Party’s “big tent.” That actually is a reflection of the intense backlash to women’s rights that began in the 1980s.

We just never truly had advanced as much as we thought we had. It’s significant that in the 1990s, Hillary Clinton’s statement in Beijing that “women’s rights are human rights and human rights are women’s rights” was considered both shocking language and the act of speaking itself a shocking act.

There are feminist legal scholarships Lars who are preparing arguments based on the 13th Amendment outlawing slavery : no person can be forced to labour for another.

But really what’s been neglected in feminism and left politics in general in the US, for over forty years, is the hard-slog ground game ofolitical organizing and political persuasion. There is nothing community-based on the left that balances the community-based influence of churches, now that unions have been decimated.

BickerinBrattle · 22/05/2019 18:29

Legal scholars! I have no idea who Lars is.

ControversialFerret · 22/05/2019 18:31

Fuck, it's terrifying to think that not only could abortion rights be in jeopardy but that there could also be a knock-on effect to the right to contraception.

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