Fair Play for Women poll on transgender issues

[Lamaha]

fairplayforwomen.com/poll/

I have to say it really irritates and grieves me that so many women think women can have a penis etc etc etc. It's bad enough that anyone thinks that, but women? Really? But it's no surprise that it's mostly young women.

But the numbers saying TWAW don't follow through in the subsequent questions. So, many people who say TWAW don't really believe it.

Interesting survey. I think anyone on a twitter or other social media will have a lot of exposure to the TWAW mantra... that will affect younger people moreso. Girls also don’t want to be “mean,” even if it hurts them.

I think most people are happy for everyone to live and identify however they want. It’s when that identification infringes on other people (for example, the woman who will now miss out on the Boston Marathon) that people have an issue.

It's heartening to see that, according to this poll, most ordinary men are, in fact, allies -- more so that women.

Yes if only men would speak up more! I know Sharron Davies has tried to get some on board but most are very studiously ignoring the whole thing.

If you look at the comments on social media such as Facebook (higher age range), men are having non of it. And they are not frightened to say.
If SH and their database cronies were to visit the Devon Live Facebook page and see the public comments on "mrs" Claus, they'd find a lot more big hairy geezers than they were prepared to deal with.

One of the interesting (albeit scary) things about this whole lunacy is seeing how women's socialisation leads us as a sex class more vulnerable to going along with something that is I) clearly not true ii) clearly opposite to our interests

Like watching a car crash in slow mo

I had a discussion with my 19 year old daughter about this. She said ‘but Transwomen have had their genitals removed and had treatment haven’t they?’. I think this is a common misconception and we had a long talk about the reality. I think that young people are idealistic and don’t know enough about the world to be clear about the issues. Young women also aren’t assertive enough to insist on their rights - give them a few decades of the working world and they’ll see how the cards are really stacked.

Young women also aren’t assertive enough to insist on their rights - give them a few decades of the working world and they’ll see how the cards are really stacked.

The trouble is the generation after them will be actively seeking new taboos to break. I honestly dread what comes after this.
For my generation, saying Fuck out loud or having sex before marriage was the epitome of breaking down boundaries. We were so proud of ourselves.

Sad to see the number of "don't knows" or "prefer not to say", what is wrong with these people?
Anyway, it does show that the majority do not think TWAW.

The next step along this road to hell will be paedophiles trying to claim rights. They’re already watching with interest as the trans rights brigade try to insist children have capacity to consent to treatment that will mutilate and sterilise them for life. How long before saying that a child you’ve groomed has the capacity to agree to child rape? We successfully crushed this in the 70’s when the revolting PIE (paedophile information exchange) were campaigning loudly, but they haven’t given up.
Previous generations campaigned for rights that didn’t hurt the rights of others. Gay people harm nobody by loving each other and marrying.
Gay men don’t demand entry to women’s toilets, changing rooms, prisons or sports. Similarly, living together outside marriage doesn’t impinge on married people’s rights.
I wish the “woke” youngsters would truly wake up and see how aggressive autogynephile men have hijacked the trans movement to inflict their sexual fetish on women.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3387001-Anybody-think-we-could-do-with-some-accurate-polling

Original thread about this polling. Quite a few here contributed to the crowdfund for it. Red does some great analysis on the thread.

Note that Helen Staniland, who originated it, has this week been permanently suspended from Twitter for saying that men are more violent than women - not even anything to do with trans.

Again on the subject of young female votes: this is particularly disturbing in the question of sports -- an entire 40% of 18-24 year old women agree that transwomen should be allowed to compete! This is the age group most likely to be competing so they are actually voting against themselves? It just doesn't make sense! I mean, I can almost understand them not caring about changing rooms or smear tests but sports???

The views of young women are concerning. How much is about the online world of influencers, group think etc. Where are the feminist groups for young women that aren't lib fem. How do they get their info. Young women are in a desperate state.

Sports are a minority interest for women, lamaha. And (IME) younger people are more self-absorbed and less genuinely able to empathise with other women. Fewer really believe TWAW on the issues which they are personally affected by.

One of the interesting (albeit scary) things about this whole lunacy is seeing how women's socialisation leads us as a sex class more vulnerable to going along with something that is I) clearly not true ii) clearly opposite to our interests

This. The age profile is really interesting, not surprising, but it is worrying for young women. Older women give fewer fucks about being nice. In my experience we've often suffered more as a result of biological reality plus have kids we want to protect and so are unwilling to defer to random men.

Younger women are also heavily into the mating process, and want to please men -- if only subconsciously. So even if they know, deep inside, that TWAM, they might still claim that TWAW so as to please men.
As an older woman, widow, far beyond the mating game I'm absolutely indifferent to the opinions of men.

How did the survey define males and females?

"Again on the subject of young female votes: this is particularly disturbing in the question of sports -- an entire 40% of 18-24 year old women agree that transwomen should be allowed to compete!"

Again not surprised having an idealistic 19 year old myself. She has had a protected childhood and has no experience of male aggression (went to an all-girls school). She rarely reads the news. This whole thing has been presented as the next gay rights and this sounds idealistic and forward-thinking. My 24 year-old daughter by contrast is a lot more realistic having now been in the workplace for a few years.

"One of the interesting (albeit scary) things about this whole lunacy is seeing how women's socialisation leads us as a sex class more vulnerable to going along with something that is I) clearly not true ii) clearly opposite to our interests"

Absolutely. One of the best things about getting older is to be relieved of any need to be 'nice' where it is against my interests.

Good point Snuggy. How many of the “women” respondents were adult human females?

'If you look at the comments on social media such as Facebook (higher age range), men are having non of it. And they are not frightened to say.'

Is this why they have started with women.

If they can get women to capitulate, also to frame as a 'womens issue', then when it gets into wider view and men say wtf, the answer is, none of your business it's a women's issue and women are happy with it.

This could be why no debate / threats to non compliant women etc are so strong and swift. They must squash any and all dissent in order to have an argument when men start to notice.

Fucking female socialisation. The transborg has really done a number on younger women - totally indoctrinated them to chant TWAW on pain of being a transphobe and "not nice".

I presume the whole point of paying populus (a reputable polling company) to do this is so it doesn't end up with a skewed sample so I think we can discount the idea that it was skewed by lots of be-penised individuals who identified as women.

I have an 18 year old daughter and asked her these questions. She has never had a smear test so said having a male do it would be fine until I pointed out that she is currently waiting 3 weeks to see a female doctor because she didn't want to see a male one. I think younger people can agree things in the abstract but it's only when they see the reality that they realise what it all means. This is why surveys like this are flawed because they are not asking people about things that they have direct experience of. I would like to know what e.g. female prisoners make of sharing their space with male bodied people.

I honestly don't understand some women, especially Americans. On my own stomping ground, a forum peopled mostly by Americans, people are very woke. It's where I first heard the term cis, many years ago.
There's a popular woman there, who is now on Facebook, who was raped brutally as a ten year old child. She is now a single mother and because of that rape she is very vigilant abot her daughter. I remember one post of hers where she was totally uptight about parents who allow their children to go anywhere alone.
And yet she is a HUGE trans ally and is always going on about how transfriendly she is, and so is her daughter. I wonder if she would want her daughter to be naked in a changing room with naked men.

She is also actively looking for a new long term partner (she doesn't do casual sex) and relates quite openly her adventures on dating sites. She has a few criteria, such as no republicans and no Trump lovers, and has been having a hard time finding the perfect man. I have seriously thought about suggesting she go with a transman. If she were completely honest she would be looking among them, as well, after all, TMAM???

ooops, that should be my old stomping ground, now own. I don't go there any more unless I have specific questions.