Are men-only activities problematic?

[MsTiggywinkletoyou]

Do they uphold the patriarchy, allowing bonding that excludes women, or is single-sex social space a generally good thing? Some seem even-handed (a couple of hours a week of time-tabled single-sex swimming in the local pool, equal time for men and women). Some are clearly not: the establishment "gentlemen's clubs" that still don't allow female members. This story made me wonder:
I had been asked to make a documentary about the crisis sweeping the morris dancing world. The oldest morris organisation, the Morris Ring, had stuck to its men-only tradition for nearly 100 years. But numbers were dwindling and some teams were facing extinction. Perhaps the way to resolve the problem was to invite women to join. A vote was called and a near century-old constitution was overturned.
How a gender war sent the morris dancing world hopping mad

This is a strange story as many Morris sides have been mixed for years, and there are lots of women's sides too, as it does mention in the article.

Depends what it is.
Boy only ballet or crafts groups are redressing the balance.
Men's choirs and men's health groups e.g. for cancer survivors make sense.
Dads and tots groups may be easier for dads to go to than parent and toddler that's 99% women.
Men's drinking clubs... not so much.

I agree that it depends.

Suicide amongst men is a massive problem and men only activities and groups may support that. Groups like Men’s Sheds for example menssheds.org.uk

Groups that want to keep women out because they are anti women, like golf clubs, can do one.

Men's groups make absolute sense. For example - Dads & lads bonding, the Shed for older lonely chaps to get together to do hobbies & crafts, men's physical & mental health support groups, there's a men's wing of my menopause Facebook group that's there to help them help (and to be honest, cope with) partners going through it, suicide awareness ... Loads of great reasons. We know how beneficial women's groups are to us, why shouldn't men have the same rights!

If women’s groups are allowed then you can’t really say that men aren’t entitled to the same privilege.

Why on earth should they be problematic?

Single sex groups are fine if they're meeting a need specific to that sex, as mentioned upthread, or if there are properly equivalent men's and women's groups. There may be a problem if something exists only for one sex for no good reason or to the detriment of the other sex - historically these were common and some may still persist. And there's a problem if there's separate groups for good reasons but one sex is seen as superior, receives more funding etc (eg football)

It's fine as long as they are not holding any power including soft power. My problem is with freemasonry as it's so linked to politics

Agree with annie- fine unless linked to power.

I’m involved with boys only reading groups in schools. Not a problem when they are addressing diaadvantage.

Lots of lovely supportive examples. And then the Masons. And then I remembered the ne plus ultra of men drinking together (have I got the Latin right, Boris?):
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullingdon_Club

Well we really want men only sports teams to continue.
I think sex segregated activities are healthy for all, when there are comparable activities available for both sexes.

It's when men's drinking clubs and golf clubs are used as business tools that women are excluded from that I have an issue.

If women’s groups are allowed then you can’t really say that men aren’t entitled to the same privilege

I don't think it is helpful to think of women only spaces as a privilege. For the women who need them, they exist to redress structural, historical or physical power imbalances between men and women. And they only go some way towards achieving this aim.

Of course men suffer their own problems (suicide being a big one as mentioned) but these problems are not directly attributable to women, in the way that many of women’s problems are to men. There seems to be this drive to take women's spaces back but men will discover there is no way in which this will help them. The magical thing that they think they want disappears as soon as they arrive. It just hurts women.

A lot of men's only clubs came about when women only had minimuma access to opportunities in public life in the first place. They were just forcing women to stay home where they belong. They were no different to racial segreation. Purely discriminatory.

There have been some good examples mentioned above of whe it's appropriate to have men only events.

I disgaree about male toddler groups though. Those are almost always organised by women with extra perks to entice men into coming and looking after their own fucking kids. Usually held weekends when working miohers would benefit from them but they aren't welcome. And remember men ARE welcome at the other groups. Men are under-represented because they have traditionally chosen to avoid parenting drudgery. Unlike a group for women within a male dominated field where women have been traditionally barred from participation.

Women broke through the barriers of various groups one by one. Imagine being the first women to attend Cambridge. Or join the army.

I think men can attend a church playgroup.

Those are almost always organised by women with extra perks to entice men into coming and looking after their own fucking kids. Usually held weekends when working mothers would benefit from them but they aren't welcome.

True. However those women organising will have been compelled to do this to meet targets imposed from above to demonstrate 'reach', and its only by offering the perks and the tempting times that men can be enticed through the doors so they can tick the box.

I also think men only clubs are fine provided they are not stopping women from accessing power. Hence why men only golf clubs where a lot of business is transacted are problematic.

All male dance teams are fine, it doesn't stop women's or mixed teams existing.

Agree with others that it’s fine, except in those cases where it’s attached to power.

Good question.
No easy answers.

Unless it's at the male dance clubs (Men's Sheds, etc.) that the deals are made, nowadays. I've heard that weekend semi-competitive cycling is the new golf, in terms of men spending hours and hours hanging out together and networking. Hence the rise of the MAMILs (middle aged men in lycra, for those who don't want another MN acronym).