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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Guardian outdoes itself ...

40 replies

CraXXed · 23/03/2019 11:16

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/mar/22/parents-lgbt-primary-school-lessons

This article is just incredible. To use the recent NZ atrocity date for some blatant muslim berating is bad enough but to do it as a disguise for attacking anyone who dares cross Susie Hurty Feelz Green is just revolting.

Susie, the murdered and their families are more important than you. Show some respect.

Seriously, just when I think the woke couldn't get any worse there is a barrage of anti muslim sentiment being pushed this week of all weeks. The "it's just like gay rights" effort hasn't worked in the past and it won't work now. So so sick of TRAs seeking to undermine and blatantly attacking everyone covered by the equality act.

OP posts:
Caucho · 23/03/2019 20:42

They never ever allow comments on such articles either as when they have everyone just piles on calls them out on their bullshit. Must be fun and games in Guardian towers with Hayley Freeman bumping into Owen Jones at the water cooler

RepealTheGRA · 23/03/2019 20:44

The Guardian cannot die a horrible, painful, flaming, humiliating, financial death soon enough

Can they be sued for being complicit in this current shit show? Because let’s face it, if they actually did some ethical, investigative journalism instead of promoting ideology, this could’ve been kicked to the curb already.

You’re complicit in child abuse, guardian.

zanahoria · 23/03/2019 20:52

The faux liberalism really annoys me, especially the way that Caroline has been portrayed as the big bad Catholic.

FermatsTheorem · 23/03/2019 21:34

Ah yes, good ole Gabby "what did they expect, flaunting their mobile phones" Hinscliffe.

Gingerkittykat · 23/03/2019 21:59

*Is it very bad of me to think every time I see an article by Gaby Hinsliff- "would it have killed you to drag a brush through your hair before that photo was taken?"

She is a terrible writer.*

@LassOfFyvie

Yes, it is very wrong to attack any woman for her appearance. Criticise her writing or opinions all you want, but by criticising her hair just makes you sound pathetic.

This is a feminism board after all.

OldCrone · 23/03/2019 22:08

I really don't understand Gaby Hinsliff's point of view. Just reading this article and the one from January 2016 about the Cologne NYE attacks, she seems to be saying she has sympathy for young Muslim men who sexually assault and rob German women, because they have previously lived under repressive regimes and they're used to having superiority over women, but she views Muslim parents who have concerns about what their children are learning in school as reactionary bigots, and there is no excuse for their bigotry. She seems a bit confused.

LassOfFyvie · 23/03/2019 22:15

Yes, it is very wrong to attack any woman for her appearance. Criticise her writing or opinions all you want, but by criticising her hair just makes you sound pathetic

Does it ? I really couldn't care less. Her hair is a mess. Not only is it a mess it looks as if it is deliberate to give her some sort of credibility. She' s far too busy being a clever feminist to care. Her writing is terrible.

LassOfFyvie · 23/03/2019 22:20

Exactly Old Crone- that was my point. The twisting she must have had to do to get from expressing sympathy for Muslim men carrying out physical attacks to criticising Muslim parents simply expressing an opinion.

Gorse · 23/03/2019 23:11

For what it's worth, I saw a YouTube video about the anti LGBT demo. Virtually all the protesters were male, so presumably fathers? The apparently gay HT was subject to much verbal abuse, albeit from afar as he was nowhere to be seen. I subsequently heard that the education authority had withdrawn the book from 4 schools in its catchment, and promised not to raise the subject of LGBT again in those schools. The program was to continue in its other schools.

ChattyLion · 24/03/2019 08:56

FFS Guardian. Shocking to try to paint this as a religious issue. On these boards alone- we can assume there are hundreds or thousands of women- and men who agree with Caroline Farrow on this one issue- and many of us won’t agree on any other issue with each other. And these are people of all religions and of no religion.

But we are happy to talk together and share information to try to safeguard our children and the children of others as best we can against the bitter realities of sexist, homophobic stereotyping- including via today’s transactivist genderisg politics which specifically targets children and young people.

We are adults who agree that it’s wrong to remove from healthy children key options from their future adult lives: like capacity for normal fertility, capacity for normal physical sexual function and the possibility of physical sexual pleasure, as well as going through normal puberty which is essential for lifelong physical and mental maturation - like skeletal maturation and laying down adult bone density. Or adult intellectual maturation, which relies on post pubertal brain.

It’s obvious that it is wrong to permanently remove fundamental attributes from children and young people (i’d say anyone under 25) at an age when the young person can’t comprehend these losses, but will have to live lifelong with the consequences of a decision made by others.

That’s why we have the concept of a child’s right to an open future.

It’s this open future that is obliterated by medical, hormonal, surgical intervention on children and young people. Along with their right to be same-sex or opposite-sex attracted in their own perfectly whole body.

Genderism tells children* they’re not authentic unless they undertake pain, risk and a lifetime of remaining a medical patient. In exchange for what?- all this immeasurable personal cost and loss, in order to try to fit in with a simulation of a tired old set of harmful sex stereotypes.

It’s just awful the more you look at it.

*and we should think carefully, about why genderism does not require the same permanent physical commitment of adults? Why is an adult lauded for coming to work in a pink lacy dress a few days a week with no suggestion whatever that they change themselves (award winning Pips Bunce) whereas ‘trans’ children are encouraged to crush their developing breasts, take puberty blockers, hormones, egg retrieval and storage, save up for a double mastectomy, hysterectomy, deal with vaginal atrophy and maybe eventually radical surgery to create a ‘penis’.. ? By harvesting skin from elsewhere on their body?

Or encouraged to tape up their penis, take blockers and hormones, save up to remove their penis and testes, have radical surgery to create a new body cavity which they have to dilate painfully to keep open?

AstonishedFemalePersonator · 24/03/2019 09:03

Very good points from OldCron and ChattyLion.

Popchyk · 24/03/2019 09:05

Brilliant post, Chatty.

God forbid that The Guardian should explore even one of those points.

ChattyLion · 24/03/2019 09:56

I’m not trying to say that religions and their interpretation by subsequent generations humans don’t have generations of work to do ahead of them, to sort out how they shelter and promulgate sexist homophobic oppression (while if they want to, retaining principle and doctrine that are sexist and homophobic- if that circle can ever be squared)

My point is we ALL have do this work against sexism- religious or not. (And personally I think that homophobia arises from sexism btw and the sex stereotypes arising) Singling out religions for criticism therefore doesn’t help or deal with sexism as well as promoting the fallacy that religious leaders and followers always agree.

Sexism is pervasive in every culture I can think of and in nonreligious institutions (hello, the Guardian) in charities, businesses, schools, individuals, sexism is everywhere. Sexism is alive and well in every culture which has people in it.

And we have to start tackling this somewhere or we’ll all go nuts. So why not start on arguing to protect kids from this one specific genderist ideology with immediately obvious physical harms? Then, hoping that gets somewhere, we can see what other issues we can agree on where children are being harmed by sexism.

Then look at adult harms from sexism. Or work on these in parallel- or work on whatever specific area we need to tackle. There isn’t any set way of doing this and it all helps.

But it’s still wrong and self- serving to paint these concerns as religiously based or the solution to resolving these issues lying only with religions or believers without also pointing out that the same problems and mix of views and mix of actions to remedy sexism are also found in people of all religions and no religion.

Coyoacan · 24/03/2019 16:54

Well said ChattyLion, I love your posts

ChattyLion · 25/03/2019 09:13

Backatcha Smile

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