Advice, please: response to gym changing room letter

[VickyEadie]

I wrote to my local council with regard to the changing facilities in the 4 gyms to which I have access. I'm not at all satisfied with the response and can handle most of it, but could use some advice from knowledgable FWR posters on how to word my response to this bit, about their policy on transwomen's access to women's changing facilities. Bear in mind that some of these gyms have an entirely open-plan women's changing room - absolutely no cubicles at all:

"Whilst we do not have a specific policy on this issue we are guided as a service by the Council's overarching policies on equality and diversity as directed by the Equality Act 2010. It is unlawful to discriminate against a protected group of individuals whether knowing or otherwise and our guidance to staff on this matter is that customers can use the most appropriate changing facilities to which they identify. This may mean that we have transgender customers using either male or female changing provision within our facilities."

Any advice on wording my response - I believe they're breaking the law with regard to single-sex provision, for example - would be appreciated.

Bumping for traffic - I realise I need to be patient!

Some stuff here you could repurpose: fairplayforwomen.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/EA2010_womensrights_-factsheet.pdf

I'd also make them clearly state their definition of "trans" (bet your bottom dollar is the fully trans'd TS, not the current TG, 80% keep their dicks etc)

But maybe also chuck in that self-id is not a thing (yet), so any user would need to show proof of their eligibility of a single sex space if challenged. Don't specify what proof or you get into the laughable GRC/Birth cert/you can't ask me dance.

Also ask what their provision is for women who have religious, cultural, safety etc requirements. And there was a thread recently about the lady who mentioned one possible reason for her child was something about social services obligating her to keep said child in single sex spaces like this.

Thanks for that, buzzbobbly.

Also ask about the limits of their liability insurance and who underwrites that coverage for them, and you could even ask if sir insurers are aware that they are choosing not to use the single-sex exemptions permitted by law and instead allowing mixed-sex use of facilities where women and children change and shower, even though statistics (documented in a Times article) clearly show that mixed sex provision increases risk of assault.

Mention that you are aware that being made aware of a risk and doing nothing to mitigate said risk increases an organisation’s liability exposure if harm occurs.

Thanks for that, BickerinBrattle

Am writing my response taking these suggestions into account.

Bicker Also ask about the limits of their liability insurance and who underwrites that coverage for them, and you could even ask if sir insurers are aware

Did you mean "Zir insurers"?

Ack! I’ve misgendered the insurers!

😳 Have to go now. The police are at the door. Tell my mum I love her.

Also mention that they are discriminating against women by breaching their rights to single-sex spaces under the EqA. They are moreover discriminating against men if they allow males who identify as trans but don't have a GRC (ie are still legally male) into female-only spaces while denying access to all other males. Single-sex facilities constitute a perfectly legal example of discriminating against someone, namely on the basis of their sex. However, excluding someone from opposite sex spaces is only legal if all others who are not legally of the other sex are also excluded. So any male who doesn't identify as trans and is therefore denied access (while other legal males are granted access although they are not legally female) could sue them for unlawful discrimination.

Furthermore you could add that you will consider that they are facilitating sexual harassment of females, including female children, if they allow fully intact males to strip naked in the open plan changing rooms. I find you often have to spell this out to them as most people still think this is about post-op transsexuals.

I’d point out that they can be ‘guided’ by the council policies, but ultimately the responsibility is theirs, and not the councils, to ensure that the actual law is followed.

Thanks to all - this has really helped.

I'm going to finish it off tomorrow. I intend also to ask about risk assessments and ask for their safeguarding policy.

I have nothing to add re your letter, but I’m literally holding my head in my hands that you are having to do this. The worlds gone absolutely mad. Depressing.

Look at this thread for comments on the legal position, noting that it is different depending on whether someone has a GRC or not. It is entirely legal (i.e. compliant with the Equalities Act) to exclude transwomen, including those with a GRC, when it comes to open plan changing rooms.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3536978-Complaint-to-my-council-about-school-changing-room-some-legal-help-please

Sex is a protected characteristic, so allowing people to use the changing rooms of the sex they identify with means they are failing women under the protected characteristic of sex

Point out that in order to not discriminate against women OR people with the protected characteristic of gender reassignment, they need to provide seperate facilities suitable for each. Finish up with a reminder of how important sex segregation is to women who follow conservative faiths, and that conservative faiths include Christian people, Jewish people and Muslim people, so ensuring the changing rooms are suitable for all women means that they get to tick another box when assessing how well their facilities comply with the Equality Act.

Oh, and if they haven‘t already covered it, ask them about the maximum age of children of the opposite sex permitted in the changing rooms (it’s usually about 8) and if the same rules apply to trans identifying children? And if not, what additional safeguarding rules are in place to protect the trans child from seeing/interacting with adult strangers of opposite sex bodies? And are female children and minor youth who identify as trans allowed to swim topless? After all, 80% of trans children desist, so it’s not usually a permanent change of status...

Thank you to all who've added comments since I was last here - all really useful.

Thanks for posting this. I'm in an identical situation & currently procrastinating!

Just to update - I've sent a letter making all these points and asking specific questions. I've also asked what risk assessments they undertook prior to implementing the policy of 'use what changing facilities match your preferred gender (sic)' and have asked for a copy of these risk assessments.

👍

Looking forward to hearing about your new, improved response!

I shall keep you informed...