Society not nature makes girls play safer than boys

[Cwenthryth]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/society-not-nature-makes-girls-play-safer-than-boys-n0589l7b7?shareToken=318d9dc9f5484a2475b62773a1f6f102

From a gender critical feminist point of view, this is “male and female children’s behaviour is not biologically determined, shocker” but a very interesting article, I’m interested to find the original study comparing these two Chinese cultures.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/society-not-nature-makes-girls-play-safer-than-boys-n0589l7b7?shareToken=318d9dc9f5484a2475b62773a1f6f102
Sorry, clicky link

Interesting culture (the Mosuo one), I want to look more into that. And yeah obviously a duh thing, I've always encouraged my DD to take risks and she does but since starting school (interestingly daycare did not really have an impact) she is definitely becoming less of a risk-taker.

Amusing observation. In my local park, there's a zip line ride in the children's play area down a slope. Children sit on a little seat and fly down it at speed, the seat swinging from side to side. To my aged eyes it looks pretty risky; the speed, the swinging, the potential contact with the ground.

But it's always surrounded by little girls. En masse they cling together on the seat and hurtle down. It's not safe! (well it is, obviously because, it's an LA playground) Whenever I pass and see a child there, 9/10 times it's a little girl

I went shoe shopping for the DC at the weekend and was struck by how the girls' school shoes seemed to have less grip/function than the boys' shoes, which seemed more suited to active play.

Small things like this have got to have an impact on how comfortable it is for girls to take risks and how safe they feel doing so, even if they're not aware of it themselves. If you don't have sturdy shoes, are you more or less likely to feel confident climbing trees etc?

Try the outdoors shops, ewe, some have very practical 'kids shoes' in the same styles and a range of colours.

Re risk taking, in women apparently there may be a 'nature' factor in risk aversion - there was a study which compared men and women but they tracked it over time, Women were observed to be more likely than men to take risks during the most fertile part of their menstrual cycle, more risk averse at other times. I'm not sure how marked the effect was, and obviously it doesn't affect prepubescent girls.

The Mosuo are one of the few matrilineal and matriarchal people in the world, so it seems an excellent choice for this sort of "culture clash" study. Han, for those who don't know, are mainstream Chinese, over 90% of the population of China. Mosuo are also arguably matrilocal, in that they practise what is translated as "walking marriage": the woman stays in her mother's home all her life, and her boyfriend/partner/non-husband visits overnight, returning to his mother's household in the morning. This was all very fine and well when they lived in mountainous isolation, but over the past generation, with China's modernisation, roads and tourists have come to Lake Lugu, and guess what, a lot of outsider men want to come and sample Musuo life for a night... and are willing to pay. So by 2013 there was "a red light district where mainly south-east Asian prostitutes dress in Mosuo costume, acting out tourists' fantasies."

I remember reading a memoir by a girl who grew up there before the roads, and left as a young woman. I just went to look up its title and found that Wikipedia has a whole article on the women. And the book is called Leaving Mother Lake: A Girlhood at the Edge of the World by Yang Erche Namu.

www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/19/visitors-flock-chinas-kingdom-of-women-luga-lake

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosuo_women

Sorry if this is seen as thread hijacking but I love learning about strong women, and strong cultures, around the world.

Totally anecdotal of course, but as very young kids my DD was always way more risk averse than my son, she was the one climbing everything, cracking her head open on stuff (oh the joys!), running around etc As they have got older she has become way more risk averse, noticeably so, although you still see that 'spark' in her iyswim and I'm trying to keep that going, but the other thing about her is that she is stubborn and outspoken as anything (something else I don't want her to lose actually!) so can be difficult to 'reason with'.

Agree about the shoes. Girls shoes really are fucking shit and are made to withstand waaaaay less than boys shoes. I especially notice this with supermarket shoes - I always get DS's school shoes from one of the supermarkets, the leather ranges are great, sturdy, good quality, well fitting and affordable. The girls shoes from the same places are shite. Utter shite.

very young kids my DD was always way more risk averse than my son,

Did you mean 'less risk averse' in that?

TBH risk taking is one of those things which sometimes seems to be held as a masculine virtue but can be catastrophic. I was pleased my DD (no other DC for comparison) tended to look before she leapt ... ie did the risk assessment before climbing the tree, thought about whether to reef a sail before casting off...that sort of thing. You can climb higher up a sound tree than a rotten one, and boats sail faster the right way up.

Just thinking now, DS (who is just a toddler still and at home with me rather than at daycare) is much more risk adverse, he thinks long and hard before attempting something like climbing, and then quickly decides against it where as DD as a toddler definitely leapt before she looked.

Did you mean 'less risk averse' in that?

Oh yes, I think I did actually! She took more risks!!!

Both my boys have been very risk averse as youngsters. The older more so, more things made him nervous as a baby but at around 3 became much more confident climbing etc. His cousin (boy, same age) was always extremely nervous around playground things and still is. Mine has a very outgoing personality and never clingy when out and about. Not much seems to upset or scare my younger one (nearly 1) but he's exceptionally gentle with anything alive (people, kids, dogs etc).

I read somewhere recently that children's play is very similar till around the age of 2, after which it starts to be influenced by peers and social factors such as stereotypes / opportunities.

Hijack away Tiggywinkle that’s all really interesting stuff! I’ve just ordered the book second hand for a few quid to go on the ever expanding, will never actually get through them all to read pile, I’d not heard of the Mosuo before. Sounds like a great society.

Cwenthryth Could I persuade you to start a thread with a book report, eventually? I hope you enjoy reading the memoir.

I've just put the book in my cart too! Sounds interesting, I think my daughter would be interested in it, thanks for sharing!

The topic of this thread reminds me of this piece:
www.huffpost.com/entry/if-our-sons-were-treated-like-our-daughters_n_6698346

I have a dd who has never had any thought for safety.

I used to be stopped all the time by people who wanted to commiserate that my little boy kepy my hands full, tell me about boys being so active at that age but i’d appreciate it when they were teens as i wouldn’t have to deal with girls drama and moods.

I’d nod and say yes, she’s always been like this and they’d look at me like i was mad and say you mean he? No, she. Then they’d shuffle of either embarrased or thinking i was insane calling my son she.

I canNt believe we are reversing very rapidly back to victorian gender stereotypes.

ALittleBitOfVitriol Thanks for that topsy-turvy short piece. I'll dream about it tonight.

I think the ridiculous clothes girls wear nowadays don’t help either - when I was a kid I would never have dreamt of wearing dresses to go outside to play (and nor would I have been allowed to), whereas nowadays I see girls all the time in playgrounds with dresses on, tripping over them trying to climb and swing and slide. It’s dangerous and daft but mums have said to me “oh she won’t wear anything else” and in this day and age kids rule the roost!

Could I persuade you to start a thread with a book report, eventually?
Eventually :-) thanks for the tip though, I’m looking forward to something in my feminist reading that’s (hopefully) not just so dreadfully depressing as everything else!