A brave and stunning "six-foot aggressor"?

[Twowheeler]

www.mancunianmatters.co.uk/content/090377927-pictured-anti-abortion-protestors-confronted-passerby-dramatic-scenes-outside

I've been involved in pro-choice counter activity outside abortion clinics (supporting women who want to access the clinic, not interacting with the anti-abortion campaigners) and these shifts were overwhelming covered by women. Yet, when I hear about physical confrontations with the other side, they seem to come from those who would never need an abortion themselves and are not the demographic who do the standing outside in the cold supporting women.

Seriously, have feminists prevented access to hormone therapy by harassing individuals as they enter the clinics? I must have missed those stories.

I don’t think that’s a good comparison Lang, these people are harassing women trying to access healthcare. Again I’m not saying it’s ok, violence isn’t. Neither is harassment. I was harassed quite aggressively going into one, we weren’t in the right frame of mind to defend ourselves properly, but later I thought how much I would have liked to push them the hell out of my face and well away from the clinic.
When white women surrounded my brown skinned Mum and abused her, would it have been ok for me to get violent? It’s not always a clear cut situation. In this case this person is clearly in the wrong. I just happen to think the harassers are equally so. It’s not like they’re having a private meeting at a church, they’re outside a clinic for the sole purpose to harass. I think it’s ok to say both things are wrong.

So a man attacked a woman. Plus ca change.

"When white women surrounded my brown skinned Mum and abused her, would it have been ok for me to get violent?"
Urgh how awful. How did you deal with it?

"When white women surrounded my brown skinned Mum and abused her, would it have been ok for me to get violent?"

No one surrounded that male and abused him. If a pregnant woman had knocked one on her ass after being assaulted that would be a different story.

You'd have been well within your rights to defend you and your mother had you been attacked. WTH does this have to with this story? People keep conflating racism with white men assaulting women.

Please tell me your mum is a kick box expert and had them all on the floor begging for mercy within ten seconds.

Are they calling the assailant "she" in the piece just because of that frilly skirt thing?

Knobs.

WTH does this have to with this story? People keep conflating racism with white men assaulting women.

If you’d read my other comments you’ll see that I have been aggressively harrased at such a clinic. That’s why I raised that. I’ve also said in this instance the person assaulting them was wrong. Had it been a couple accessing the clinic together, who felt harassed and had their path partially blocked, would it be ok then? I guess I’m talking outside this specific incident. Sorry I didn’t know that wasn’t allowed.

Please tell me your mum is a kick box expert and had them all on the floor begging for mercy within ten seconds.
No, she’s had a lifetime of racism and DV so a bit weakened. I was too shocked and on the other side of me a Māori man with full face moko was being arrested for doing the same thing as me: walking peacefully in a march about land rights.

Damn :(

Jessica I too have been harassed outside an abortion clinic. Many years ago. Was the worst experience of my life. They were holding pictures of fetus’ in my face and shouting at me ‘don’t murder your baby it’s hearts beating’ and things like that - in that frame of mind, I just cried and pushed past them.
Looking back now, if I saw someone make my daughter feel that way - I really don’t know what I’d do, but pushing their leaflets out of their hand would probably be a mild reaction.
Violence isn’t the answer no, but the emotional torture they caused that day hit me harder than any punch in the face I’ve ever received.

I have no sympathy for them tbh

We can’t defend freedom of speech and decry male violence only for women whose political or religious views we agree with.

I can't say I feel too much sympathy for the elderly protestor but I am pissed off that some bloke with 'ishoos' is having his violence described in such a careful manner.

Proper headline:Bloke in dress attacks retired pro life protestors!

Buuger - bold fail

Bloke in dress attacks retired pro life protestors!

Freedom of speech is not always a good thing. You wouldn’t be able to stand outside a mosque shouting ‘Muslims are killing people’ or outside a BME meeting being racist. It should be the same for harassing woman and girls outside of abortion clinics and calling them murders etc.

Just because the harassers in this instance are white pensioners that look oh so innocent, doesn’t make it ok.

The comparison to feminists at a meeting is also wrong. If feminists were stood outside gender dysphoric clinics in order to target and abuse transwoman then maybe, but as it happens - this is not the case.

Freedom of speech is not always a good thing. You wouldn’t be able to stand outside a mosque shouting ‘Muslims are killing people’ or outside a BME meeting being racist. It should be the same for harassing woman and girls outside of abortion clinics and calling them murders etc

I think that all three of these things would be a breach of the peace and /or incitement to racial hatred and the police should be called. I agree it’s wrong.

It I didn’t realise that’s what these women were doing. I thought they were standing and praying . I think they have rosary beads in their hands. We can’t stop people praying In the streets.

I don’t agree with what these women were doing. But I do think they should have the same civil rights as everyone on this thread.

I was harassed quite aggressively going into one, we weren’t in the right frame of mind to defend ourselves properly, but later I thought how much I would have liked to push them the hell out of my face and well away from the clinic.

Which is why I am advocating exclusion zones.

I am not at all in support of violent males physically aggressing pensioner women.

And I'm certainly not in support of women being fine with that under any circumstances, let alone when other solutions are available. There is absolutely no difference between condoning and/or turning away from VAW because it suits a pro-choice opinion than there is because it suits a gender identity ideology position. End of.

LangCleg Fair points. I would say though, it isn’t in this situation that the pro lifers are ‘having an opinion’, they’ve gone to a clinic to force their opinions on others and harass them into doing what they want. It doesn’t excuse the violence in this situation, but if what we saw here was a woman and her daughter trying to access this clinic in peace and the mother pushed these people away instead of this person, I think we all would have a different reaction. In this circumstance I would expect the attacker to be arrested. I would, like you, also want an exclusion zone so that these protestors could also be arrested.

It I didn’t realise that’s what these women were doing I don’t think the story details exactly what they were doing, but I’ve experienced harassment and so have other women.

There doesn't appear to be any evidence that the ruffian was a woman, so why does the report assume that he was one? Perfectly normal for a man to have long hair. So one tiny suggestion, the fact that his upper garment hung below his jacket, lead them to assume he was trans.

Harasssment is of course wrong and the police should arrest those doing it. But I didn’t see anything in this article to suggest that the victims here were harassing anyone - maybe I missed it?

People holding different beliefs or standing praying in the street is legal. Holding placards is legal. I think that exclusion zones would be a reasonable compromise, but there’s nothing to indicate they were in place here.

Freedom of speech or belief isn’t worth anything if we only extend it to those who agree with us. Otherwise we are using the same arguement as the TRAs who say that by disgreeing with them we are committing literal violence.

It’s highly unlikely that that person will ever need an abortion isn’t it?

Jessicawakefield, I can entirely understand why you don't sympathise with the people outside the clinic. If I were in your shoes, I'd probably feel pleased to see them getting some of the same treatment they'd dished out to me. I don't for one moment think the people who gather outside clinics are just there to exercise their right to free speech and they should be stopped from hanging out there. There should be exclusion zones to protect women who are going into the clinics: nobody should have to put up with what you did.

I really see why you feel this way, but from a political viewpoint I don't think this is the way to deal with the issue as it can be exploited by the harassers, who will then become 'victims'. I also doubt the motives of the person involved because I've seen young men jump on the bandwagon of other issues as an excuse for violence.

Token pro life bod offering comment. I don't support vigils like this. I understand the motivation of the people who participate, and it's mostly kindly meant, but I don't think it's especially helpful and that there are other far more effective means of reducing or eliminating abortion. I think that exclusion zones are probably a reasonable compromise wrt balancing the rights and freedoms of everyone.

However, this is clearly a bloke being violent towards women he disagrees with. I can't support that in any circumstances. There was a video last year of a pro choice man round-house kicking a younger pro life woman he was talking to on the street, completely without warning. These men are not feminist allies. They are just misogynists who value a righteous outlet for their impulses.