Those Birmingham parents are right Teaching primary-age schoolkids about sexual matters is weird.

[OtepotiLilliane42]

I think the parents of this school were right to object to teaching primary school children about complex sexual issues. As Brendan O'Neill says, the basic biological facts of human reproduction should be sufficient at that age.
Anyway, what do others think?

Something sinister is happening in both official and campaigning circles: people are using children, very young children, to try to reshape adult thinking and society more broadly. Perhaps fearing they will not be able to convince actual adults that transgenderism is a good idea or that children as young as six can be ‘gay’, instead the new moral instructors seek to inculcate kids with these ideas in the hope that the ideas will then filter into the home and into stupid adults’ brains. It is a highly undemocratic and sly way to try to bring about social change. If you want that school in Birmingham to teach children about gay sex and trans lifestyles, then convince the parents first – don’t use the kids as moral shields against what you clearly view as the imbecilic, backward adults they tragically have to go home to every night.

www.spiked-online.com/2019/03/06/those-birmingham-parents-are-right/

I think the story was spun in a particular way to make it about "homophobic Muslim parents".
I bet there was a lot more to it than that.
In later reports the transgender element was mentioned very briefly, almost in passing.

In some ways it is young, but on the other my dd 7 surprised me with loads of questions about when she could have a boyfriend, a baby, why I did not have babies before I met her daddy etc etc etc

So they do pick up stuff from kids and just life going on around them - isn't it then better that it's factual information with space to ask questions about what they think?

I had a very thorough look at the lessons they were concerned about. Most were excellent: age appropriate and focused on inclusiveness.

The one on transgenderism was markedly different- flat out 'boys can decide to become girls'. A couple of other lessons were odd (too much value judgement) and not age appropriate.

If the tone in which the changes were communicated was in line with that second set, I can quite see why Muslim parents would be very uncomfortable.

Teaching kids that families come in different forms is not inappropriate. Kids books are full of references to heterosexual families. Nobody is saying go into graphic detail- just make sure they grow up knowing that there are a range of different family forms. The transgender lesson sounds a bit out there but these parents are primarily protesting about homosexuality. That’s what their placards said anyway.

Yes I'd be pulling my Kids from the lesson too.

They already know men can marry men and women can marry women.

What concerns me is the deliberate hiding of trans indoctrination behind the it. Amd now they have something even better. Muslims. They can add that to the " defence" another layer of people who can be used to make out that anyone who objects is some massive homophobe along side them.

Parents should have the right to have some control over what their children learn.

I agree strongly with the above point about representation.

The transgender lesson sounds a bit out there but these parents are primarily protesting about homosexuality.

In the lessons I read there was little reference to homosexuality, certainly nothing concerning. There was some excellent treatment of racism.

The deputy head who wrote the scheme seems very woke (mostly in a good way) and a little strident. I suspect this is more about communication and cultural sensitivity than content.

That said I (woolly liberal with trans family) would have had an issue with that one particular lesson if taught as written. It was just factually wrong.

We looked at one of the lessons from his book. It used a picture book aimed at very young children, alongside a set of questions about the Equality Act (aimed at much older kids). I know he is up for best teacher in the world award, but that lesson was a bit rubbish, just from a teaching perspective.
As for the content, I don't see ANY resources aimed at or for use with children, that don't use very harmful stereotypes. Girls can like to do mechanics, boys can like to wear sparkles.

Gender Incongruence is a really complicated issue; no one actually knows why it happens. To boil it down to sex stereotypes/ "gender" hurts everyone and should certainly not be taught.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I would pull my primary age children from that too. I don't know how you teach this, unless it's treat people as you find them, don't judge on appearance etc.

Since I live in NZ I looked at how schools here teach about sex and reproduction. This website is for parents' information, and I think it does a good job of explaining clearly that what is taught is always age related, and that parents have a right to be consulted. Extract below:

Do schools have to consult with parents?

Boards of trustees have to consult with school communities at least once every two years on their draft health curriculum. This includes how the school will implement health education, including sexuality education.

This is your chance to ask questions, share your ideas, and express your views about what you would like to see happen in this part of the curriculum.

How the consultation happens is up to each school. After consultation the school’s board will approve how the health curriculum will be taught.

On respecting different beliefs:

Will my culture, religious beliefs and values be respected?

There’ll be a range of views in your community about the place of sexuality education, some of these will be based on culture and, or religious beliefs. Schools try hard to respect differences in culture and religion.

If you are concerned about sexuality education, it’s important to talk to your school first. Your child’s teacher may not know about your beliefs, or the things that are important to you, so make sure you tell them. If you’re still concerned, talk to the principal or contact your school’s board of trustees.

You have the right to withdraw your child from particular parts of sexuality education by writing to the principal

I imagine that this is the kind of sexual education programmes that UK schools teach, with consultation with parents before implementation?

parents.education.govt.nz/primary-school/learning-at-school/sexuality-education/

If the tone in which the changes were communicated was in line with that second set, I can quite see why Muslim parents would be very uncomfortable.

I don’t think you need to be Muslim or even religious or conservative to object to a Trojan horse being slipped in amongst some very good stuff.

And if that head didn’t communicate and agree a PSHE curriculum with his particular parent cohort in a culturally appropriate and sensitive manner, then he’s a fucking idiot.

Did he write most of it and outsource the shit bits to someone else? Is that what happened?

This is the problem with LGBT issues in school, everything is bundled together. It's one thing teaching that same-sex couples exist - we see them on television almost everyday. They're just men loving men and women loving women.

However, start teaching trans issues, how do you explain that? You're straight into boys having periods, people can change sex, gender identity and all of the Mermaids crap.

Age appropriateness is the key here. Children need age appropriate, factually accurate information.

So from a young age, accurate naming of body parts, and being taught that they have boundaries (the NSPCC PANTS stuff is great on this.)

A little older, the very simple basics of reproduction, and a simple message of ‘loving families can look a lot of different ways, mum and dad, single mum/dad, stepfamilies, same sex families, carers/guardians.’ Nothing more than that is needed. Keep teaching about boundaries, and ALLOW kids boundaries.

To go into adult sexual dynamics at a young age is wrong. To give factually inaccurate information (born in the wrong body/can change sex) is wrong.

‘Sexuality education’ should be for MUCH older kids - the biological basics and teaching them boundaries comes first. Sex and sexuality are not the same thing and are not appropriate at the same age.

Also genderism is NOT a sexuality!

I think there is absolutely fuck all need to teach kids about sexuality or transgenderism. Facts of life, yes of course. It's also fine to talk about different family compositions eg-

Kid a lives with grandma and dad
Kid b lives with mum, sister and brother
Kid c lives with mum and dad
Kid d lives with 2 parents they call dad
Kid e lives with foster mum

Etc - because this is reality and actually relevant to kids in understanding and being sensitive about each others family set up. They really dont need to be sexually or ideologically instructed.

X post

The intention isn't to teach very young children about sex. It is to teach all children about their relationships, bodies and autonomy. When children are abused the abuser will tell them its normal and they believe it happens to everyone. The classes in schools are designed to teach children the pants rule and privacy and relationships and will protect them from harm. It is common knowledge that the first time that children who are sexually abused throughout their childhoods know it's wrong and not happening to everyone is nearer their teenage years when their friends start talking about boyfriends/girlfriends or they learn about it in school. Most children are abused in their own home so I believe that the best way to protect them is for schools to step in. If an abuser knows the child they are harming/ intend to harm will learn about privacy and relationships at school it may stop them acting.

I had a very thorough look at the lessons they were concerned about. Most were excellent: age appropriate and focused on inclusiveness.

I also did this and disappeared down a day-long No Outsiders rabbit hole.

Like you say, most of the lesson plans are great - focusing on anti-bullying, live and let live, introducing children to the fact that some people look or behave in different ways and some families don't look like yours. Age-appropriate, not overly detailed.

On the downside, I agree the transgender lessons were chock full of offensive sexist stereotypes and, more importantly, the political ideology/quasi religion of gender identity theory is presented as absolute fact.

The stuff about EqA for KS2 starts out with an accurate listing of protected characteristics but go on to include many instances where sex is conflated with gender and gender reassignment is conflated with gender identity.

There is nothing about girls and their specific needs for boundaries, privacy and dignity based on the protected characteristic of sex. Given the epidemic of sexual harassment and even assault in our schools, including our primary schools, I have to ask - why this omission?

I would not want to throw the baby (all the good stuff) out with the bathwater (bad stuff) but I would, on balance, withdraw my children from these lessons too.

By the way, here is a screenshot quoting from the statement of protest by the parents.

I also find it worrying that, just as sex education is made compulsory and parents withdrawing their children could face fines or even jail, the most popular programme of materials includes wrong body theory as established fact.

We looked at one of the lessons from his book. It used a picture book aimed at very young children, alongside a set of questions about the Equality Act (aimed at much older kids). I know he is up for best teacher in the world award, but that lesson was a bit rubbish, just from a teaching perspective.

This one?

equalitiesplans.blogspot.com/2015/10/transgender-equality-are-you-boy-or-are.html

This:

On the downside, I agree the transgender lessons were chock full of offensive sexist stereotypes and, more importantly, the political ideology/quasi religion of gender identity theory is presented as absolute fact.

I could be wrong here but I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that the school has 750 pupils, 600 of which are Muslim. Does anyone know if this is correct? As it really puts things into perspective.

that lesson was a bit rubbish, just from a teaching perspective.

Yes I've been trying to raise concerns about this for a while. Some The books have the born in the wrong body narrative (esp the ks1 one) Plus yes the lesson plans aren't great.

I notice you can comment on the additional resources...

Yes I've been trying to raise concerns about this for a while. Some The books have the born in the wrong body narrative (esp the ks1 one) Plus yes the lesson plans aren't great

Well given when teachers etc receive the training they are told such gems as " stop being so academic" I'm.not sure what else we could expect

Some of the content is described in both these threads:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3516346-Compulsory-trans-lessons-in-primary-schools-what-will-this-involve

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3385878-anyone-know-about-the-no-outsiders-in-our-schools-book-pack

A lot of the pack is very good at covering other aspects of diversity however. Lots of really good books covering disability, racism and differences.

^ Two threads there, some how merged.

Is that what Moffat says in the training Gerry? I know my local LEA bought him in.