Hormone blockers for "cis"-"gender" children

[gcscience]

I watched Louis Therreux's recent trilogy and found it most moving and thought provoking.

So when his previous programmes came up on BBC iplayer, I saw and watched the transkids one. Very depressing and tragic in so many ways.

But then a horrible thought occurred to me: what is to stop this madness spreading to the point where any child, whether trans or not can demand puberty blockers just because they don't want puberty?

Just that really.

It shocked me so much to consider it. But just months ago I was similarly shocked by the idea that transgender kids received puberty blockers.

I am fearful for our children's/grandchildren's futures, more than ever.

I considered not posting this horrific concept...but it's no more horrific than what is already happening to the "transkids", so I'll risk banning by posting it.

It's a horrendous thought and the word cis can fuck off

We are male and female

Isn't there enough to worry about without worrying about things that aren't happening, and no one has even suggested?

I think it was the girl who'd had a double matectomy that made me think it: it seemed like a clear case of ROGD to me. And the boy who was worried about his future as a transwoman, and the way the psychologists/medics reacted, minimising and not hearing his concerns, which was hideous. And the boy who seemed to have changed his mind and now wants to be a dad with kids (luckily before any medical interventions).

And the adult transman who claimed her penis was functional , and seemed mostly bothered about how others perceived them.

Yes there is but what if I'm not the only one who is thinking this?

things that aren't happening

It is happening though isn't it? To "trans" children.

That was half the point of my post in a way: by our familiarity with this concept perhaps it loses some of the power to shock. (I wasn't aware of being normalised to it by the way). I was just as shocked when I heard about "trans" kids being on blockers several months ago, but I felt that same shock anew tonight (no more no less than the original time).

@MNHQ Reporting thread for deletion please as unhelpful

You have to report by actually pressing report??

They can say no

But then a horrible thought occurred to me: what is to stop this madness spreading to the point where any child, whether trans or not can demand puberty blockers just because they don't want puberty?

Isn't that already happening?

Who totally welcomed their own puberty? Who felt totally comfortable with the physical, emotional and social changes it was going to bring, and did of course bring? Who didn't try to escape from at least some of it?

Our parents called it 'angst', rolled their eyes and waited/shouted/commiserated.

Today it's called 'gender this-that-or-the-other'.

NHS says 'watchful waiting', but some non-medical organisations say 'affirm, don't question, or your child will kill themselves!' and 'medicate now, or your child will kill themselves!' Yet the vast majority of non-medicated children desist.

I don't think you're actually all that far off with this scenario. Mental health among our children and adolescents is in crisis. I can easily envision a shift to "medicating" children who are experiencing puberty-related psychiatric symptoms (depression, anxiety, rage, opposition, etc.) with blockers to alleviate their symptoms and "allow more time" for them to adjust. It will be viewed as beneficial for them, their families, schools, etc.

And, don't think for one second that Big Pharma won't be backing this with lots of self-funded studies and "evidence based" positive outcomes. These drugs are REALLY expensive, (many thousands a year per child, bringing in millions for the pharmaceutical companies), and they would love to expand their market.

Until the avalanche of side effects starts to roll. With enough time, we'll be looking at this period of history wondering where the grown ups were...

@gcscience I don't think it's unhelpful, I think it's interesting.

It is basically what's happening now, if you take the view that many on here do (including me) take, i.e. that there is no difference between a "trans" and a "non-trans" child except their self-perception and their desire to change themselves and their environment to fit it. This is in the (conscious or subconscious) control of the child themselves and have been widely recognised as a (maladaptive) strategy to escape from the horrors of growing up female, just like anorexia is commonly believed to be.

I was thinking about this recently because my friend has a trans child (born female) who is on puberty blockers. It made me think about whether I would allow a child of mine (I have none so this is hypothetical) to take them. And I realised with quite an internal shock that actually I might. Not because I believe in "trans-ness", but because I could not refuse a readily available method of avoiding becoming fully female at a tender age in such a hostile world. At 16 or 18 you would have more mental resources to be able to handle it.

I'm assuming here for the sake of argument that they are genuinely reversible and safe, by the way - I know they may well not and of course that would stop me from allowing them but I am being hypothetical here.

When I hit puberty in 1990 it was horrid. I immediately stopped cross-country running, which I was just getting good at, because I couldn't bear to run around the streets in "P.E knickers" with my newly developed thigh flesh (which I tried to starve away) flopping obscenely about. Boys would pinch bums and boobs, and teachers thought it "naughty" rather than abusive. Grown men in the street would comment on little girls' bodies. There was so much everyday sexism it was more like "everyminute". In some ways we have really come far.

But that was the era when famous female singers wore jeans and T-shirts, pink was for babies, and the word everywhere was that sexism was on its way out - more and more women were achieving those high places and it looked like it was going to get better and better as the MCPs grew old and died off, replaced by New Men who knew their way around a bottle of Mr Muscle. And most of all, those naughty boys were looking at Page 3 or Viz on the school bus, not a constant stream of women and girls being mentally and physically tortured.

If I had a daughter and she said she could not bear to grow into a womanly shape because of the onslaught of objectification on a scale of foulness far beyond anything that existed then, I don't think I could refuse.

I would have blocked my puberty in a heartbeat as a teenager, I believe. As would have many girls I knew at the time, I believe. There was this obsession with superlean bodies, no breasts, no hips...

If it gets further normalized, I think quite a few girls might 'feign' being gender questioning, just to get this 'look like a model' effect on their bodies. Do puberty blockers mess with female body height by any chance?

@gcscience I don't think it's unhelpful, I think it's interesting.

Same here. I think this has the potential to become a problem even with 'gender conforming' girls in the future. Particularly if the blocking enhances the traits the fashion/model industry is after.

Op, you don’t need to get the thread deleted. It’s an interesting and relevant question. What indeed is there to stop doctors offering blockers to children who just don’t fancy going through puberty, or are thought to be not yet ready to cope with it??
Also, as an aside, the phalloplasty surgeon in one of the Louis Theroux documentaries is being sued by several of his patients who’ve had horrendous complications from their surgeries, including having to have stoma bags and king-term catheters.

I agree with George, it's not an unthinkable scenario and part of safeguarding is thinking ahead into possibilities which seem unthinkable. I'm seeing the "I don't want to grow up" thoughts starting in Y6 children already, influenced by trans YouTubers.

Prescribing will start in the US where money and customer demand talks louder than ethics, though.

Drug companies are always looking for new markets...