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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Legal red light zone was mistake, says its pioneer

46 replies

PimmsnLemonade · 08/12/2018 00:31

www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/legal-red-light-zone-was-mistake-says-its-pioneer-3km90k83s

OP posts:
AngryAttackKittens · 08/12/2018 10:13

Well Lauren certainly is on fine form today!

Rehab? Forcibly changing their minds. Nazi.

Because offering someone access to programs that can help them kick their heroin addiction is like murdering millions of people.

LassWiADelicateAir · 08/12/2018 10:22

Yes I wonder who "Lauren" is. The Nazi comment was in reply to me. ( I'm using a pseudonym on there)

ChewyLouie · 08/12/2018 10:40

I hope this gathers momentum and develops into positive changes in the longer term. Since the council has supported this for the last few years I hope they now find the funding to support addicts, their children and those living in the area. A legal zone sends the messsge selling your body is acceptable, well actually if women (or men) are having to resort to this, society needs to take a long hard look at itself.

arranbubonicplague · 08/12/2018 10:41

Personally I'd like to see a whole different approach to prostitution. People who sell sex are 99% of the time desperate. They need help. I'd love to see prison reform groups target this population of prisoners with a comprehensive program of help

I think that would be the Ipswich Model.

1 An end to targeting the women with criminal sanctions and instead providing them with substantial support to help them exit prostitution and rebuild their lives.

2 Tackling men’s demand for prostitution. They used the kerb crawling legislation and number plate recognition technology to implement a zero-tolerance approach. They found the majority of the punters they arrested were “ordinary” guys who were married or in long-term relationships, often with children and good jobs. The police made a strategic decision to avoid naming and shaming the men because they felt this would have a negative impact on their families. So provided the men took responsibility for their behaviour and accepted a caution, they were not publicly named. The vast majority of the men who were arrested accepted this approach.

3 Preventative work with children at risk of being groomed into the sex trade to prevent another generation of women on the streets.

nordicmodelnow.org/2017/11/14/how-a-nordic-model-approach-to-tackling-prostitution-was-implemented-in-ipswich/

TheQueef · 08/12/2018 10:48

Thank you for the share token.

I saw the BBC series on Holbeck, how they justify managing prostitution like this is beyond me.
It's obvious what a stupid solution it is.

arranbubonicplague · 08/12/2018 11:18

reported crime has increased citywide by 50 per cent from 2013-2016.

Basis,...one of the biggest local advocates of decriminalisation, argues that those numbers are encouraging, because many of those crimes might not have been reported previously.

I don't understand this - I read this as an increase in overall crime citywide. This, to me, reads like they've created a zone of conducive context that permits criminal activity to increase around it and its malign impact is spreading.

Not all conducive contexts fit this model, however, there are a number where the usual hierarchies of gender are in flux, jeopardy or transition. Here conflict, dislocation and migration constitute contexts in which the vulnerability of women and girls is accentuated by external conditions over which they have little if any control.
...
Jackie Turner (2013) has developed this analytical frame with respect to trafficking, noting that in international human rights thinking women’s vulnerability derives from their subordinate status in gender orders (Connell, 2009). They are, in turn, disproportionately affected by conflict, economic crises and the deepened inequalities heralded by globalisation. At the same time women migrants have fewer options for legal migration and are thus more reliant on the irregular routes controlled by smugglers and traffickers.
...
In some sexual violence is authorised from the top, in others it becomes part of the ‘repertoires of violence’ of smaller groups of men and here the reach of military and state control, and whether there is a sense of impunity, play a role in determining in which conflicts and which locations sexual violence becomes embedded.

discoversociety.org/2016/03/01/theorising-violence-against-women-and-girls/

A zone of lawlessness and abuse spills out to create that context elsewhere.

ChewyLouie · 08/12/2018 11:30

You’re right Arran and it would be interesting to see the breakdown for the citywide increase in crime for males and females.

ChattyLion · 08/12/2018 17:19

It is absolutely shocking that the powers that be can leave a whole area and its population to be literally fucked over like this. Sad

ABitCrapper · 08/12/2018 19:44

Would a crime map like this
www.adt.co.uk/crime-in-my-area
help work out crime rates?

ABitCrapper · 08/12/2018 19:47

Or this?
crime-statistics.co.uk/postcode/ls11%205bd
Or
www.police.uk/

LassWiADelicateAir · 08/12/2018 20:38

Thank you. One of the links covers Scotland. In October 2018 within a mile radius of my postcode (central Edinburgh, not a remote rural location) 2 crimes were reported- 1 for shoplifting and 1 for violence and sexual crime. The contrast could not be starker.

arranbubonicplague · 08/12/2018 20:56

Well, that was an eye-opener. >450 offences in my area during October. The number of anti-social behaviour reports is not a surprise but I am taken aback by the high number in the "Violence and sexual offences".

Still, nothing approaching Holbeck and its 1842...

LangCleg · 08/12/2018 21:06

1 antisocial crime in my area.

Gileswithachainsaw · 08/12/2018 21:07

Wow those are sone stats....

No.wonder police didn't want to divulge them

Gileswithachainsaw · 08/12/2018 21:09

219 crimes in my area.

78 violent and sexual offences.

ABitCrapper · 08/12/2018 21:11

Giles I am in a similar area to you.

ABitCrapper · 08/12/2018 21:13

Could someone add the crime stats to the article comments?

Gileswithachainsaw · 08/12/2018 21:31

abit
It makes me feel even worse for the residents of holbeck.

I work in a town centre.. late ish. I walk home several times a week late at night.

In the past 2 months I've had 2 lots of people yell out their cars at me. Sone one overly close on a bike behind me.

Reported 2 crimes to the police

And see frequent police presence and sometimes arrests. Fights. Shouting amongst drunks and homeless people.

I cannot imagine what those poor people in holbeck.put up with.

And even worse the police don't even have the decency to admit the scale of the problem..

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 08/12/2018 21:56

Oh my god that crime thingy is fascinating

37 crimes in my area...the vast majority in the village centre or at the school, about 15 violence or sexual assault (not at the school..only about 6) and when i say school i mean in the vicinity

And holbeck has 1800 plus+ ???

That's awful

ABitCrapper · 08/12/2018 22:05

I live next to a cut through from the local pubs to the main part of a housing estate.
We get lots of drunken shouting, singing etc, and lots of cans/ bottles etc chucked in our hedge. Fights.
We also get a lot of burglaries in the area, and have a problem with gangs of lads on bicycles being threatening and antisocial
But that's nothing company to Holbeck.

ChewyLouie · 08/12/2018 23:29

Thanks for crime figure websites, the figures for Holbeck are shocking. I wonder if anyone is/has looked at the change in figures of crimes by men towards women over the last few years in Leeds in general and whether this has shown a similar increase for both sexes.
Really brings home how adopting TWAW would actually mean women on women crime stats being wilfully distorted to disguise men on women crime stats 🤥

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