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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Graham Linehan: Leave Aside Shame and Embarrassment, Defend Women's Rights

18 replies

arranbubonicplague · 01/12/2018 10:33

@Glinner tells his own story of seeing the light and issues a rallying call to others not to remain mired in shame and embarrassment but to be consistent in standing up for women's rights:

If you can't shame someone into silence, disrupt their networks and isolate them. In tandem with countless other stratagems, it's effective. bindelj was in the wilderness for years thanks to this kind of approach.
Here's how effective it was. For years I was scared to follow bindelj because the consensus was that she was some sort of monster who collected trans children in a sack. The truth was she made a mild joke 15 years ago. But I was just as hypnotised as everyone else.
That's one thing I would say to everyone. If you're beginning to see the cracks in mainstream gender ideology, and you're a little embarrassed for not thinking it through before now, don't let your embarrassment stop you from doing so. [thread continues]

twitter.com/Glinner/status/1068530640432246785

He captures it beautifully and I hope that it does help people to pause and reflect.

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Bittermints · 01/12/2018 10:37

Good for him. I had the pleasure of meeting Julie Bindel briefly last night. No sack over her shoulder! Brilliant speaker.

AngryAttackKittens · 01/12/2018 10:37

I think anyone who's honest about not being comfortable with the way trans politics has gone is likely to lose friends over it, at the very least. And I think we should do it anyway.

That's how manipulative people (particularly those with Cluster B disorders) operate - divide and conquer, insinuate and smear, reinforce the desired behavior with love bombing and teach the target never to repeat the undesired behavior by throwing everything from threats of rape and murder to threats of suicide at them . Keep people on edge, feeling like they can never "get it right" and always need to be seeking approval for what they're thinking. S

It's an abusive relationship in macro form, basically.

teawamutu · 01/12/2018 10:44

Glinner, respect to you as ever. I'm nearly feeling brave enough to retweet that one... Nearly.

AngryAttackKittens · 01/12/2018 10:47

Also so bizarre to observe the monstering of Bindel, who's always struck me as being an absolute sweetheart who cares deeply for the wellbeing of other people.

arranbubonicplague · 01/12/2018 10:53

divide and conquer, insinuate and smear

As ever, Jane Clare Jones (aka @LadyPrincesexual ) has a useful perspective. In response to another thread (you'll get the gist from her comment), she writes:

The fact that this person can go down this train of thought, as if she is having a new and original thought, is actually staggering to me.

But it's a pretty good instance of the blunt analogy that makes the idea we're genocidal lunatics so intuitively appealing to left/liberals. [thread continues and is worth reading]

twitter.com/janeclarejones/status/1068616892082991109

So, that's grand. We're accustomed to being labelled transphobic bigots, domestic terrorists and so forth. On the scale of smears, how to we feel about being likened to the bubonic plague and (as JCJ correctly identifies) genocidal lunatics?

Am I alone in suspecting that the ramping up of the absurd rhetoric feels like a counterpoint to the softly-softly re-education approach that Esther Betts mentioned? And rather in line with the 'rehab.' and PR strategy outlines in the meeting that was reported on?

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AngryAttackKittens · 01/12/2018 11:03

Absolutely none of this is random and grassroots. It's been the result of careful planning in back rooms from the very beginning.

arranbubonicplague · 01/12/2018 11:42

Response to Linehan's thread:

Indeed. I think we need an amnesty for all those who have, out of the goodness of their hearts, supported, promoted or enabled the misogyny of gender identity ideology to capture our public institutions, our culture & our minds. Which is most of us at some point. #GenderIDAmnesty

twitter.com/greengoude/status/1068641139190886402

Regarding AAK's comment above, this is a thought-provoking contribution from Jack Appleby to both Glinner and LadyPrincesexual on a similar line of thought:

Worth following janeclarejones's comments on what the "end game" is for the gender-critical. I am sick of the misrepresentation of feminist women (and their allies) as "evil". At some point everybody has to ask themselves: Who ultimately benefits from such a misrepresentation?

At some point the men who have been calling women "terfs" have to ask themselves: Why did you jump on a movement that allowed you to lay into women concerned about preserving their sex-based rights? The answer may shock you. It should. It should make you reevaluate everything.

twitter.com/jackappleby/status/1068671717411880961

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AspieAndProud · 01/12/2018 11:47

Twitter is an ephemeral medium. Glinner needs to get this stuff into print.

Somewhere like The New Statesmen would print it. He’s a celebrity, he has some clout. Once recognised public figure start talking about this in public others will follow.

ChattyLion · 01/12/2018 11:52

Very happy to see the truth being expressed publicly and boldly- because IRL a lot of us can’t speak up because of how far this assault on women’s rights has already gone.

rightreckoner · 01/12/2018 13:57

I agree. Glinner needs to publish something.

On a side note, I like Jack Appleby a lot too.

BlytheSpiritsSpirit · 01/12/2018 14:02

He could at least write in medium and then the guardian might print it - or is that only for Very Sorry Trans?

AspieAndProud · 01/12/2018 15:01

Even if The Guardian runs a hit-piece on Glinner in response it still gets the message out there that You Are Not Alone and right now most people who are critical think they are on their own.

I heard a term recently and forget what it was but it means the reluctance to challenge a dogman because you think you are in the minority when you are actually in the majority but other people are afraid to speak out for the same reason.

Anyone know the term I’m looking for?

hackmum · 01/12/2018 15:03

Aspie - I think that must be preference falsification, the term used in the Toby Young article that someone has linked to on another thread.

arranbubonicplague · 01/12/2018 15:15

I'm utterly delighted Glinner is doing this.

It would be immeasurably powerful if a well-regarded woman felt she could do this even if it had to be in concert with other women. J K Rowling. Sandy Toksvig. Clare Balding. Sue Perkins. Jo Brand. The young women whose names don't come fluently to me.

There are so many women who could show leadership on this issue. I have to assume there are all sorts of reasons why they aren't but it's regrettable.

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AspieAndProud · 01/12/2018 15:23

Aspie - I think that must be preference falsification, the term used in the Toby Young article that someone has linked to on another thread.

That would be it. Thought it might be something on Quillette or Areomagazine because it’s the kind of term that might pop up there.

It’s an Emperor’s New Clothes thing. Everyone can see they’re naked but they go along with it because they don’t realise everybody else can see it too.

It makes me think of the Ash conformity test. It only takes one person to speak out and the conformity crumbles.

hackmum · 01/12/2018 16:30

It makes me think of the Ash conformity test. It only takes one person to speak out and the conformity crumbles.

Except...that hasn't happened, has it? David Davies MP has spoken out, but what about the other 649 MPs? None of them had the guts to attend his recent meeting on gender recognition, even though we know from James Kirkup that lots of them are privately worried about it.

And where are all Linehan's comedian and actor chums? They're leaving him to fight the good fight on his own. It's unimpressive, frankly.

KindOfAGeek · 01/12/2018 18:09

Twitter is an ephemeral medium. Glinner needs to get this stuff into print.

Twitter is also the madness of crowds and "call out" culture, i.e. chockful of lynch mobs.

KindOfAGeek · 01/12/2018 18:23

Oh, and the MINUTE, the very MINUTE, I see someone evoking racism an analogy for "transphobia", I block, a la that Museum of African American History thread.

There were several threads not too long ago using intersectionality to dissect privilege theory and which "proved" black women had privilege over white male bodied trans women.

I really just don't have the patience for that lack of critical thinking and empathy.

Sometimes I think Kimberle Crenshaw needs to come get her theory back, it has been misused and abused so often.

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