Suicide stats

[JillyArmeeen]

Can someone link me to the real suicide stats please, and the guidance on reporting suicides if possible. Or point me in the right direction.
Trying to win an argument on the Internet. For my sins.
Thank you

UK? Try here www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/suicidesintheunitedkingdom/2017registrations

Roughly speaking, the Tavistock is now seeing 2500 new cases each year but has reported either 3 or 4 suicides in the past several years.

The suicide incidence is around 0.1% (much as we'd all like it to be zero).

Total child/teenage suicides in the UK are under 200 per year, so even if all those children were trans, the incidence would be around 1% rather than the 47% sometimes mooted.

Self-harm plus suicidal ideation is at a higher incidence than a random sample - but not hugely higher, and in fact similar to samples of other troubled young people seeing CAMHS.

www.transgendertrend.com/the-suicide-myth/

Is a good critique of how the threat of teen suicide is being weaponised

Samaritans guidelines for reporting suicide by the media:

www.samaritans.org/media-centre/media-guidelines-reporting-suicide

Thank you all very much.
Might as well bang my head against a brick wall really but there we are.
Transgender trend will be labelled as terfy I can see it now.

Information from the Tavistock - they say suicide is rare.

gids.nhs.uk/evidence-base

Yet it is also true that many young people who present to gender services are not necessarily distressed. Young people who are well supported by their family and receiving ongoing psychological support, seem to cope well with their gender incongruence (de Vries et al, 2015). Similarly, suicide is extremely rare.

Also the figures for self-harm amongst transgender young people similar to those who are gay.

The percentages for associated difficulties and self-harm appear to be in line with young people from the LGB population (Stonewall, 2012) and increasing with the general population (Whitlock, 2010). The Stonewall (2012) survey for instance states that gay young people who experience homophobic bullying are significantly more likely to harm themselves than those who aren’t bullied (61 per cent compared to 50 per cent).

Recent analysis of suicide stats by Prof Biggs after his FOI to the appropriate NHS services:

www.transgendertrend.com/suicide-by-trans-identified-children-in-england-and-wales/

Thank you all, I will have a good look at all of that and try to save them to a clipboard or something for future reference as well.
Looks like I've been blocked by the person in question on this occasion, after a nasty outburst, does that mean I win?

I find Prof Biggs's analysis really hard to follow, could anyone help me understand it please?

Why does he disaggregate the total 'at risk' population by age? He reduces the figure of 10,700 GIDS patients by 40% by excluding those aged 10-14. Does he know (though he doesn't say) that the 4 suicides were of people aged 15 or above?

The figure of 10,700 is calculated by totalling all the patients seen at GIDS over a certain number of years. He says this is an underestimate because "patients seen always exceeds referrals, of course." Is that right? I have no knowledge of how the service works but I believe that you have to be referred by a GP, rather than simply turning up. If that's true, surely referrals would tend to exceed patients?

It’s also worth noting that suicide attempt does not mean the solution is to transition, despite what Susie Green would have everyone believe.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/feb/03/experience-i-regret-transitioning

on suicide, I just saw this comment on twitter

Does he know (though he doesn't say) that the 4 suicides were of people aged 15 or above?

It's probably because the suicide rate for under 15s is so low, so he may be assuming that all the suicides were of those aged 15 or over.

Suicide amongst young children is vanishingly rare. In England and Wales, the suicide rate for teens aged 15–20 was 4.9 per 100,000 (averaged over the last decade), while for children aged 10–14 it was only 0.3.

He appears to be making sure that all his estimates are overestimates rather than underestimates to avoid potential criticism that the is analysing the data in a way which might underestimate the outcome. If he had included all 10,700 children, it would be 37 per 100,000 (instead of 62 per 100,000) but he would be open to criticism that he had included a group of children (aged 10-14) for which it is unlikely that any suicides had taken place.

Useful, given that Stonewall Champion Schools are teaching children that 48 per cent of trans identifying youths attempt suicide.
No wonder schools are scared if thus inaccurate threat looms.

I can't have my child taught this inaccurate and irresponsible figure as fact. I won't have his school believing it as truth either and intend to correct this absolutely disgraceful abuse of facts by Stonewall.

Endorsed by Barnados too...

Stonewall matetial states that 34 per cent of LGB young people have attempted suicide once.

It states that 48 per cent of trans young people have attempted it.

'LGBT young people who experience homophobic, biphobic or transphobic bullying are much more likely to attempt to take their own life than LGBT people who aren't bullied.'

The stats don’t fall off even after transition so they wouldn’t be a trump card anyway.

And we have no idea how the massive increase in ROGD is going to effect the statistics in the future when women who were pressured into transitioning as young girls realise what has been done to their bodies.

Yes I thought that was the case AspieAndProud.
I guess people who will use inflated suicide stats of vulnerable kids to push an ideology and justify sterilising and mutilating kids are pointless to argue with. They are so fucking righteous with it it's unbelievable.
They will use any trump card they can, including dead kids, including if it's not actually a trump card.

There's no validity whatsoever to the claim, often made by TRAs, that suicide is caused by oppression, discrimination, stigma, prejudice, low status, marginalization, socioeconomic hardship (like being under- or unemployed or homeless), & high rates of being victims of violence.

If those types of factors really did cause/lead to suicide, then logically there'd be sky-high rates of suicide among African American men in the US, as they suffer from all of them (& more) disproportionately. But, in fact, AA men in the US have much lower rates of suicide than white men, who account for 70% of all US suicides.

According to the Centers for Disease Control, in the period 1999-2016, "non-Hispanic black men in the US were nearly 10.4 times more likely than non-Hispanic white men to die by homicide in the United States, whereas white men were 2.5 times more likely than black men to die by suicide."

US suicide stats for adults broken down by ethnicity (in all groups most completed suicides are male) : "In 2016, the highest U.S. suicide rate (15.17/100,000) was among Whites and the second highest rate (13.37) was among American Indians and Alaska Natives (Figure 5). Much lower and roughly similar rates were found among Asians and Pacific Islanders (6.62), and Black or African Americans (6.03)."

Suicide is far more complex than TRAs claim. It's not an automatic, logical, normal human response to prejudice, bullying, unfairness, marginalization, poverty, discrimination, oppression, low status &/or having a difficult, crap life.

afsp.org/about-suicide/suicide-statistics/
wonder.cdc.gov/controller/datarequest/D76
wonder.cdc.gov/ucd-icd10.html.