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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Thread for listing the use of 'gender' instead of 'sex' on really important forms!

46 replies

ArkeNOTen · 22/10/2018 10:52

Just filling in the 'e-admissions' London school application form.

'Gender - Boy' is listed in the official application form.

I'll be back shortly as am in haste - but I think it would be good to keep a running list of this.

OP posts:
VintageFur · 22/10/2018 18:31

I've just replaced gender with sex on my son's sport's team application. He's 6 and this is an athletics club for P1-P3. Not important I know, but it annoyed me.

Wardrobehamster · 22/10/2018 18:35

Flu vaccine consent form for DC was on paper, I crossed out gender and wrote sex.

Nhs Counselling form, again on paper, I crossed out gender and wrote sex.

I’ve given up “discussing “ with gym insurance. That’s an online form. I called them and said I wanted to write down male sex as my child was, is, and always will be of the male sex. I got the phone version of a “head tilt”,and a “ well we don’t know that do we” and “ some children might be upset”.

Mumsnet- I think I’m of the male gender this month.

BrickByBrick · 22/10/2018 18:55

I had to register for my local council online portal. They had gender. I ticked 'prefer not to say' I was quite happy to fill out all other monitoring data.

I can't remember school applications but I would imagine it is an universal portal.

drspouse · 22/10/2018 19:53

wardrobe suggest to the gym, if they know better, they need several more boxes for gender. Then put "sex = female".

groundcontroltomontydon · 22/10/2018 20:05

I recently applied for a Civil Service job. The accompanying diversity monitoring form had every possible gender covered but made no mention at all of the protected characteristic of sex. How can an organisation possibly say it doesn't discriminate on the grounds of sex if it don't even acknowledge the existence of sex?

Original poster
ArkeNOTen · 22/10/2018 20:15

Oh ok. so- if I put ‘female’ under gender for my boy’s application- and applied to a girls school... that we may get a place. Then what might happen as they arrive at school - assuming that the pupils are allowed trousers, and my child were to wear them. Also assuming my child has an androgynous name -What could possibly go wrong...? Nobody ever asked what sex my child was.... who would get sued by whom...

Sorry I’m going down a rabbit hole of supposition now and have no intention of sacrificing my children’s dignity to experiment - but really - sometime soon it will get tested.

OP posts:
KatVonGulag · 22/10/2018 20:18

NHS (London north west) in the bloody sexual health clinic.

Ffsffsffsffs

KatVonGulag · 22/10/2018 20:20

I changed a recent survey work was doing to sex.

Sex is the protected characteristic. Why would we seek info on gender?

Wardrobehamster · 22/10/2018 21:54

Brilliant drspouse. It’s British Gymnastics, I think it is anyway-kids do gym as a fun club but they have to be insured?

Laughing at the sexual health clinic’s lack of a sex tick box.

Wardrobehamster · 22/10/2018 21:59

arkenotten I’ve been thinking this too. Famous state girls secondary near us. We have to apply for secondary next year. Does anyone know if the pan London online application uses sex or gender? Could have a LOT of fun with that.
When John Wardrobehamster turns up on the first day of term...

drspouse · 22/10/2018 22:19

wardrobe yes that's right - my two do gymnastics/trampolining with a club that uses BGA for insurance. Thankfully they only use it at one site, the other is a gym that has its own and both DCs have just moved to the second site so we didn't have to renew so I didn't have to get stroppy.

LesAnya · 22/10/2018 22:29

Kat I’ve also seen it on the GUM clinic paperwork! I think they also have a non binary option? Madness on a medical form

Original poster
ArkeNOTen · 22/10/2018 23:06

&wardrobehamster - yes this is the pan London application. Gender only

OP posts:
Original poster
ArkeNOTen · 22/10/2018 23:14

I think in practice what would happen (I have a dc in y8 too) is that once you’re offered the place you have to take birth certificates and proof of address etc to the school. At that point i imagine the shit to hit the fan. I am thinking this hasn’t actually happened yet - although I’m willing to bet kids who are confirming to gender stereotype have entered the system. But what is going to happen when a child who doesn’t conform (either m-f or f-m) still demands to attend by filling in the gender question ‘appropriately’. I wouldn’t intend to put a child through that but I can imagine circumstances that might make me (livingin a remote community with a single sex school much easier to transport to than mixed sex for example).

We shall see

OP posts:
drspouse · 23/10/2018 09:10

I have a friend in London with a DD who in Y6 decided she identified as a boy. She had a place in a girls school but ended up being home ed for Y7. I kind of assumed it was because of not wanting to go to a girls' school but now I'm not so sure.
Anyway she desisted and is now in a mixed school.

Wardrobehamster · 23/10/2018 10:11

ArkeNOTen interesting, gender nor sex on the pan London application...hmm.

So, most of the boys in my Ds class would get into Certain School for Girls if they were girls. There are also plenty of boys with elder sisters at the school who would get in on the sibling rule. If all the kids identified as girls en mass CSG would be in an interesting situation. Of course at the moment the birth certificate would trump the self ID (?) but in the future? I suppose minors can’t self ID...

I’d love this to happen. The school even has a policy that it will treat all pupils and staff equally irrespective of gender. I guess you just have to get in as a pupil.

drspouse · 23/10/2018 10:54

The school even has a policy that it will treat all pupils and staff equally irrespective of gender.
Actually for a girls' school this would be perfect (if they understood what it meant).
So you have to be a girl (=sex) to get in but if you present/identify as a boy they can't stop you from coming or complain that you aren't girly enough.

Original poster
ArkeNOTen · 23/10/2018 11:04

So I’m actual fact you could end up with a girls school having:
Pupils who are gender and sex female

  • wearing any uniform they choose

Pupils gendered girl but boy sex

  • who maybe wear more ‘feminine’ clothes - but, maybe, choose to wear trousers, and look suspiciously like your average ‘boy’ on the street

Pupils ‘gendered’ boys but girl sex

  • excercising their right to Accra the girls school but identify as boys and maybe wearing trousers and also maybe passing as you average ‘boy’ on the street.

But not: boys in gender and sex. Even if they choose to wear a skirt, but still say they’re a boy...?

Sorry I’m being pedantic now and I don't even know if I’ve got my inverted commas in appropriate places for my views - because hell I don’t even know what -those are any more.

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Original poster
ArkeNOTen · 23/10/2018 11:06

Oh and also: in reverse for a boys school

OP posts:
Flywheel · 23/10/2018 11:11

Athena SWAN (Scientific Women's Academic Network) survey in work only asked about gender.

Lollygaggles · 23/10/2018 11:37

Another one here who crossed out gender and wrote sex on the NHS flu jab form. Do you think anyone will even notice?

It did make me feel better though.

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