BBC: Women from both sides feel silenced

[vagender]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-45894686/gender-debate-women-from-both-sides-feel-silenced

Interesting video. Thought the GC feminist did a fantastic job especially considering she looked very young.
Watch (or fast forward) till the end, Stonewall’s stance re: #nodebate remains tragically oblivious.

I think they were both great, got their points across well and interesting to listen to, I wish we could see more like this! Thanks for posting it.
I didn't agree with everything the transwoman said but she seemed quite rational. The feminist looked really familiar but I can't place her. Great to see a younger woman being represented as there's been a lot of framing of GC women as 'women of a certain age' in a very insulting way. I'm thinking in particular of the way GG is talked about.

And therein lies the problem. Women are silenced. It doesn't matter what their opinions are, they are not allowed to articulate them in a public forum. The only ones who get to speak are the "women" who were originally men. It's almost as if men's voices are considered more important.........

That was brilliant. Two very reasonable, articulate, thoughtful young people.

#Nodebate is looking more and more bankrupt (and Stonewall less and less fit for purpose).

I really appreciate the BBC’s attempt at a nuanced debate, and bringing someone on who seems a lot more level headed than the usual suspects from the TRA side.
Nosering, absolutely agree that having a young woman represent the feminist side is excellent, and kudos to her for making her views public, that can’t have been easy.

Anyway, it’s really interesting to see the difference of arguments between the two of them. Louise (the feminist) centred here around women (plural), safeguarding etc, while Faye (I think) argues from a personal view point pretty much all the time.
Also the difference in “silencing tactics” really spoke volumes, Louise mentioned harassment, no debate, etc, while Faye seemed to indicate the “rational” trans activists were silencing themselves because they didn’t want to be involved in all the drama? Very interesting indeed.

Bump. V good

I like that transsexual woman. I can't remember her name but she did a great online interview with Venice Allen. She is genuinely concerned about how the AWA have destroyed the relationship between transsexuals and women. Her and others like her are trying very hard to stop the #no debate nonsence.
Hope to see more of this sort of thing, and even if I disagree with some of the points I would never even imagine threatening her or abusing her, like the AWA are so well known for.

The BBC have ignored the opinions of women up until now. And in the last days there is a 'flurry' of coverage and articles. Too little too late.

gncq I think the trans woman’s name is Faye or Fay.

What’s AWA?

Anti woman activists

Lots of folk in this arena named Fay/e? Is this a Radical Faeries moniker?

They’ve uploaded it to YouTube! And disabled the comments...

I think disabling comments was entirely appropriate for once.
Neither of them deserves online abuse and they're not holding themselves up as politicians, just ordinary young people (I don't know how young) showing it's possible to have a civilised debate. Duty of care and all that.

I thought she was better as the video went in, but she missed the chance to say that the issue is the danger of creating a loophole for predatory men, rather than whether or not trans people are being silenced.

And the elephant in the room was Fay describing herself as a woman and Louise not being able to disagree.

Stonewall really are pathetic these days eh. Otherwise great piece.

I just thought it was amusing that a piece about silencing/no debate had comments disabled.

I saw this video shown on the main page of the BBC news app this morning - but it was gone from the main page by lunchtime (most of the other stories tend to stay on there for at least a day), some longer.

Interesting also to click on the link it suggests for related stories - a Victoria Derbyshire episode from March, which suggests that some feminists believe 'trans women are not real women' - an unusual way of putting it, given that it's normally worded the other way around. It's subtle, but somehow wording it this way sounds to me like they are automatically assuming that 'trans women are women' is the default position, and that anyone arguing otherwise are the aberrations. It also goes on to say that such feminists believe that trans women pose a danger to other women and should not be allowed in female-only spaces, totally ignoring the point that it's not transwomen specifically that females don't want in female-only spaces, but men in general, who might be appearing to be transwomen for the purpose of accessing such spaces.

It is finally being featured on the BBC, but then immediately linked to things like this as related information. I haven't watched the further information video to see if it's good, but was a bit taken aback by the biased description of what it was about.