7yo dd- how to help her speak up for herself?

[SpiritedFarAway]

Hi all. Long time lurker on these threads.

My 7yo dd has told me this morning that the boy she sits next to in class has been pulling her hair, not sharing pencils/rubbers with her, and ignoring her when they are meant to be talking about work.

I'm going to speak to the teacher about it.
My issue is, how do I increase her ability to stand up for herself? I tell her she can tell him "stop touching my hair" or just "no" but she worries SO much about getting told off herself. She doesn't want to "bother" her teacher with it.

She has always been scared of being told off in school, I've told her that I will come and tell the teachers what is happening if they tell her off for "telling tales" but she doesn't want that either.

She almost just wants to put up with it until it and wait for it to stop.

I've looked on A Mighty Girl website for books which might help but any suggestions would be welcome.

Thanks for reading this far. I realise I could have put this elsewhere, Chat maybe, but this felt like the right place. Hope that's ok.

Sounds very difficult.
Have you tried gently asking her why she thinks that standing up for herself will get her into trouble? or why she thinks that mentioning something to the teacher would be "bothering" her?
There is after all a difference between saying "No" or "stop touching my hair" and fighting back in a way that would lead the teacher to think "6 of one, half a dozen of the other" etc. Tricky for a 7 year old to navigate, but if she learns that skill young it will serve her well throughout her life.

"She almost just wants to put up with it until it and wait for it to stop"
As I'm sure you know, ignoring it is unlikely to make it stop. And even though she may think she doesn't want you to do anything, a part of her does as she told you about the problem.
Speaking to her teacher is a good idea, then she can be on the lookout and if your daughter does stand up for herself it will hopefully be obvious to the teacher that she was provoked.

Sorry I can't come up with any better advice - I think what you are doing already is great. Didn't want to read and run.
(And I do think it is a feminist issue).

Your poor DD. Best to speak to the teacher about it - as you are doing. Hopefully the teacher will rearrange the seating plan? And put a ahem 'tougher' child next to this boy. Please tell her it's the teacher's job to look after her, she won't be bothering the teacher at all.

Thanks @SquishySquirmy

I have tried asking, she says the teacher is too busy and that the school is very strict. She's moved up to juniors from infants and it's been a big change for her (and been impressed on the children by the teacher that juniors is much stricter than infants!).

She doesn't like drawing attention to herself and can be quite self conscious which is a part of it I think.

I might get her to practice saying 'no' to me, we can do a role play maybe.

I feel relieved you agree that it's a feminist issue. Thanks 😊

Thanks @MistOnTheWater - I will tell her it's the teachers job as I haven't said that yet.

I think she's been sat next to him as she's 'good' and gets on with her work, maybe he's hoping she'll be a positive influence?

I've just read a relevant thread on Twitter about how a Mum gave her daughter the confidence to stand up for herself, starting at the age of 7 and continuing throughout her life

twitter.com/ErynnBrook/status/1046055387617775616

The message that I get from it is this: "my mum will always back me up on this. If I feel uncomfortable then she will believe me and get me out, if necessary. It's alright to remove yourself from a situation that is uncomfortable. It's not alright to put up with it."

In other words, in your situation, I would be telling my daughter to get up and move away from the hair-pulling, snatching of pencils and refusal to work together. The teacher will probably direct her back in her place. When it happens again, she gets up and moves away. Rinse and repeat. I would ask the teacher to nominate a 'safe space' that my daughter could use when the boy is being uncooperative and physical.

I think theOtherPamAyres has it spot on. She must know she has your backup, and that this isn't acceptable. She won't get in trouble, and if she feels the teacher is getting her into trouble, you will back her up.
Particularly like the idea of your daughter just walking away every time the boy is physical or problematic- it will be so disruptive the teacher will certainly have to find alternative action to asking your well behaved daughter to put up and shut up...

theOtherPamAyres The 'I've got your back' is exactly what me and DP have been doing(and still doing even tho DD is in High School). OP, please tell your DD that if she 'gets into trouble' that you will deal with it - it's not her fault. The adults handle it. It's not her fault if this boy acts like this. Since you're speaking to the teacher anyway this will help to give to give her the confidence to speak up if she needs to. Good luck.

Just ran across this article and thought of this thread: www.thenational.scot/news/16951428.girls-it-is-always-your-right-to-set-boundaries-even-in-class/?ref=twtrec

Similar theme to what Pam describes above. Healthy boundaries are definitely a feminist issue! Build them now while they're little.

My girls are pretty feisty and generally wouldn't stand for that kind of treatment - now, that is. They've both been where your daughter is and it's not uncommon at all for children of that age (I work in education and see just as many "nice" little boys pushed around by disruptive kids - boys eventually explode and girls fold in on themselves, in general).

Things that helped us: first and foremost, they know I have their back (as does their dad and we present a united front at all times). The lioness thing is a cliche but true for all that.

Practicing personal boundaries. Help her feel able to say no to the auntie that demands a kiss, the grandparent that doesn't listen and enforces gendered choices, the cousin that won't stop tickling or who takes toys, for example. If she can do it in the safety of home it's easier at school.

Make sure she knows her responsible adults. Her teacher may be run off their feet in a class of 35, but there'll be a TA or two she can talk to. My work is multifaceted but I do spend time in the TA role every week, and a good 60% of low-level disruptive behaviour is quietly told to me at break or the end of the day, or when I have one of my other hats on and there's a quiet moment. TAs are the eyes and ears of teachers if you've got staff with good team relationships. There may also be a pastoral lead she can go to. Ours runs a "worry box" - children just pop their name on a slip of paper and drop it in the box, and the lead checks it every day, coming to find the children for a chat. She deals with everything from bullying to bereavement and children can progress from the chat to groups dealing with assertiveness, friendship, extra academic support - there's a lot that can be done.

Some activity that builds her confidence and gives her roots outside school. My two do martial arts, but it can be anything they love - of the kids I've known with the best boundaries, they've been gymnasts, swimmers, horse riders, footballers, musicans - anything that gives them something away from school to build a community in can work, as long as it's supportive. I particularly love martial arts because not only are many of our female instructors great role models, it's one of the few places you'll see teenage boys and men giving respect to women and girls. Teach girls to expect respect, that it's normal, and they'll be quick to demand it when it's missing.

For issues in class, this is what I did with DD

1. The ive got your back line - I’ll support you and deal with the school
2. Speak to the teacher - say it’s upsetting DD, explain what you’ve been doing with DD (see point 3) and ask what they can so to support this.
3. I found role playing to be a brilliant and successful technique - each of you take turns being DD and the problem and make it fun, have a laugh etc. It gets DD used to saying all the ‘stop/don’t do that’ language.

I dunno really. My experience as a girl and later woman who did/does stand up for herself is that I was (and am) punished for it and/or told just to 'be nice' or that 'he's just being a boy/man' or that I was imagining the behaviours or provoked them or whatever. Maybe she just has a good grasp of reality?

Thanks everyone, especially for the links for reading for me, always welcome!

PamAyres I'm going to keep telling her that I;ve got her back. I've told her this before, but I'm going to keep giving her that message - I'm glad you've mentioned it as it is so important.

I like to option of getting up and walking away, but I do feel like she's so self-conscious she wouldn't wan to do it. I'm still going to mention it as an option for her.

SilentCrow - how old are your girls now? Dd does horse riding and loves it, might suggest martial arts to her but she isn't keen on anything that isn't animal/horse related.

We do try with the personal boundaries, eg tickling and being able to say no and be listened to, I'm going to be more aware of it though.
I like teaching her to expect respect, so its normal.

I know what you mean YetAnother, I tell her to stand up for herself but don't know if I would have been able to at 7 years old? I told her this morning that she doesn't have to be nice to people who aren't nice to her, and that when I was young people would make excuses for boys behaviour (hes doing it bcos he likes you etc) and basically told her its rubbish. I don't want this to become the norm for her and she just feels like she has to accept this behaviour. I want her to know she can have her boundaries respected.

I have to go now to pick her up and hopefully talk to the teacher, thank you for all the responses. I will be back later to read again and read the links posted too.

Thanks again :)

PiffPaff - we have done role playing before when shes had problems with friendships and found it helpful! It's funny but also means she can practice what she wants to say (like you mention). So yes, will definitely be doing this too.

It is your job as a parent to alert the teacher.

As a teacher I would have wanted to know and I have previously put the no nonsense kid next to similar.

sorry back on the computer as pissed off with trying to type on the phone.

I would take two approaches,

seeing the teacher and teaching dd to be more resilient and stand up for herself. give her some sentences to say. (stop it I don't like it) (stop pulling my hair) These things would probably stick out to a teacher above the hubbub of class discussion.

I also find the role playing useful as a parent, because if you get your DD playing the ‘other’ person, you can often get much more info about how things are being said as well as what, especially if you have a little mimic for a DD (as I do!)

Definitely recommend role playing. It seems to remove some of the anxiety when you can laugh and take turns in being the other person. It helps embed the language (hey - don't pull my hair, etc). And if anybody tries the old "boys will be boys" rubbish, you can unleash the mothership of all hell fury. Girls rock! (And us big ones are mighty scary when somebody upsets our kids.)

For me, reading this, I'd go for female solidarity, teamwork and timing....

Having boundaries and removing herself might be something she does in the moment that something unpleasant happens, but it can also be something she does on her terms if she hasn't built up the confidence to just walk away yet.

If she has a friend she can have on board as an ally, I'd encourage her to ask her friend to keep an eye out for what's going on so she can back her up.

Then at the end of a lesson, stay behind for a minute (with her friend as support) and tell the teacher "There's something happening in class that I'd like to talk to you about. Can I come and see you at break / lunch / after school please?"

If a time is agreed to speak, then the teacher is making time for her and it doesn't matter that she's busy.

I'd then role play with her the conversation with the teacher, not just with the boy. And obvs, be outside in the car when it's happening, so she's got extra Mama-shaped backup if she needs that too!

I'm dont agree this is a feminist issue. My ds is shy / quiet and hates being in trouble and also has issues with not knowing what to do when other kids annoy him, nothing to do with gender, just his personality. We encourage him to say loudly and clearly can you stop xyz (ideally when teacher is in earshot) and reassure him that if he gets into trouble for it we will go into school to defend him. We also tell him to walk away if someone is physically hurting him even if he will get into trouble for leaving his desk as no-one, child or adult should have to put up with that. I'm not sure that feeding into the gender stereotype of it being girls that are the quiet ones always annoyed by the boisterous boys is helpful at all. In my school it was 1 v strong willed girl that did most of the physical violence.

kitkat I dud say above that I've noted this in younger boys too. IME (and we had a thread on this recently), many problems arise when girls are seated next to disruptive boys in an effort to calm or nurseries them into good behaviour. It does happen to boys too, but far more common for a girl to be put into that role. As girls get older it's essential to get them enforcing boundaries because they are at risk of rape and coercive relationships at a higher rate than boys, with the pregnancy risk on top. It's not tgat it doesn't happen to boys, and god knows we need to look after them too, it's just that the rates and risks for girls are more intense on a population level.

Spirited my girls are 13 and 8, they've been training since they were 7 and 4 respectively (and I've been at the same club for five years myself). We got hooked because our sensei does regular demo sessions at local schools - in fact I know there's another ten children in the school who've joined because of us! and a dozen more who do other martial arts styles or boxing - but if you don't have that option see if you can find a club with someone she knows who's there already. If not, look for a family-oriented club that welcomes parents joining in too. That's what makes ours so friendly and supportive.

I'm back, typing on my phone so sorry if I miss anything.

I do think it's a feminist issue, silentcrow has explained it better than I could.
Ever since dd was little I've been really aware of letting her know she doesn't have to hug anyone she doesn't want to, it's her body etc. These are also issues for boys and if I had a son who was quiet and sensitive like dd I'd also be annoyed he was seated next to this child and being bullied.

I've spoken to dd and spoken to the teacher, he said he will keep an eye on things and move her if needed. She's asked me not to say anything else to him so I've agreed for now.

My issue is really building up her self confidence so she can speak up for herself, she's now saying she doesn't want to role play (which she's normally keen to do for friendship problems!) and that she just wants to leave it.

I like the idea of taking a friend with her after class to speak to the teacher, that's a good one.

Silentcrow your martial arts club sounds fab! I'm going to do some research on local ones...

This is my go-to author for kid advice, maybe something of use on her website: www.ahaparenting.com/parenting-tools/safety/helping-bullied-child

I just want to add that our school also pushed the 'its stricter in juniors' angle. It just washes over the kid who needs to take it in. But it frightens the kids who really don't need to change their behaviour. I tried to make my daughter see that if the teacher is saying to the class 'now you're in juniors you should be taking responsibility for your self' or whatever it is, they are not actually talking to her but to the kid next to her and his ilk.
An aside i agree boys can experience this too. Mine does. It's a feminist issue on a macro level because of the way girls are brought up not just by us but also by the wider culture. But boys can experience it and they might find they are not deemed sufficiently boyish and are punished in other ways.
Hope it goes well op

Thanks Scrimshaw, looks helpful.

@Manderleyagain you've got it spot on! She's told me that some of the 'naughtier' kids have already been sent out of class for bad behaviour (including the boy she's been seated next to) and that "they don't care" whereas she's terrified of getting told off for sticking up for herself! It's frustrating.

Completely agree with that you said about how it's affects boys and girls too. Thanks for commenting, she has had a better day today which is something 😊