Is it just me who gets a sense the tide is turning?

[rebelworld]

I’m not sure if it’s because I’m in an FWR/Twitter echo chamber, but for the first time I’m starting to get a sense the tide might be turning. I’m feeling cautiously optimistic. High five to all you brilliant women out there - including all the lurkers (who knew!). I can only hope it’s not too little, too late.

There are still so many people living their own lives who are completely oblivious to all this madness. As soon as you have people on TV on in the Daily Mail proudly denying reality they are immediately Peaked Transed.

For example I spoke to a good friend yesterday (who has a life) who had never heard of any of this, I was explaining about self ID and when I told her about Ian Huntley changing his identity and transwomen claiming to be lesbians it was game over.

Just stay on the side of objective reality and science .

I think the tide is turning
And for that I want to thank the fabulous Posie Parker
And the idiot Harrop who climbed into her web
for Posie

I think the tide's turning too but they will double down; think it will get worse before it gets better.

The key is to keep on exposing TRA actual behaviour to the light and to the general public. Do everything we can to do that and focus on getting them to show their true colours and the tactics being used. Maximise publicity every time they do. It's great we're getting the press interested and have so many great journalists onside.

They just can't help themselves anyway (Exhibit A: one Mr Harrop). But they will do whatever they can to stop these things being publicised.

Yes I agree. Many women have worked relentlessly to educate and inform us and this had had a huge impact. Also, the TRAs have gotten away with so much, for so long, that they've become lazy and arrogant. They've made some terrific own goals of late which has also been helpful!

Men have money, power and arrogance. But women have wisdom, solidarity, resourcefulness and bags and bags of humour! Women are the most resilient by a country mile and we organise on a shoestring.

This war isn't over by a long chalk but the direction of power is most definitely shifting.

Women have to look out for our children's welfare. It is the law. And being ordered into allowing predatory males into our children's lives, under the cover of trans, is a no-brainer! No, we do not accept this. We do not want predatory males in spaces for women and girls, no matter how they "identify".

Born man with a penis = definitely man. Not a woman.

It is very simple.

I genuinely feel that not only is the tide turning with the gra but with female solidarity too. Women are starting to realise that the greatest and most powerful force we have is each other. I feel immensely proud to be an adult human female at the moment, as well as incandescent with anger which I think many other women are feeling too. It's the revolution, it's happening.

Jean Hatchet on an exchange at Manchester Standing for Women in Manchester, 28 Sept.:

Woman last night : “really it’s a shame you all have to waste your time on the trans issue when there’s so much to do in feminism”

No. There isn’t. All the rest depends on this. If men can say they are women and women have to believe them - they killed feminism. It’s over.

When men take the word “woman” from women and use it for themselves it is the most aggressive collective act of male violence against women and girls you will see in your lifetime.

These men know .... oh yes they know... that if we can’t define “woman” ... we can’t name our oppressors “male”. We can’t fight them. We can’t overthrow them.

Let this pass and it’s over women. The whole game is up.

Fight now. For feminism and for your lives as women. (Do read the full thread and exchanges with commenters.)

twitter.com/JeanHatchet/status/1046022461945524225

That last line gives me the chills. Eve of battle chills.

It is. TRAs inadvertently attacked someone a while ago they shouldn't have. This will have repercussions.

Yes, the tide is turning. Which means we are dealing with a wounded animal, and the TRAs will get increasingly more aggressive and desperate. We just have to keep speaking the truth, loudly and clearly.

I'm less optimistic.
I think self-id is the gold-standard for progressive looking governments. After Canada, Ireland, Malta and Portugal and maybe a few more in the future, the pressure to follow will grow to a chorus of "there have been no problems there". There are incremental changes, like the acceptance and more widespread usage of the term cis, that turn public discourse towards a generalized acceptance of the attitude that this is just like how homosexuality was treated and everyone opposing it is an old bigot on the wrong side of history.
The narrative really is about individual personal struggles that elicit a great deal of sympathy. I also think it's viewed as such a tiny issue and no one will care about the definition of women if they can gain progressive points on Twitter. They see the backlash against people who don't agree with the agenda and don't want to see themselves aligned with people like David Davis, even if they agree with him. Many are cowardly and I bet happy to screw women on this one. It's not a big deal enough for most.

Charlie you can't just say something like that and run.If anyone wants to PM me and prevent death by curiosity I would be most grateful.

Most people are not in agreement with self-ID and awareness is rapidly rising. I've been out speaking to the public and most people have heard something about th eissues and are not in support. Those that haven't heard are incredulous. One man yesterday couldn't believe it, on self-ID,'why would they do that, it's the most stupid thing I've ever heard of, it's dangerous'.

Whilst it may feel like the tide is turning, I suspect it's more likely the waves are getting bigger...

I worry people out there will ignore it because twitter is mentioned so much. I see it's importance but a lot of people will probably just think "oh twitter crazies, that's not the real world". Just need to make sure the word is spread regarding real life events too.

I really hope the tide is turning, I think it was inevitable once the issues were understood outside of the political and chattering classes because most people just won't go for it. They're not that stupid - although I think people are generally tolerant and probably see the issue as about letting people live the way they want, without thinking it through.

When we spoke with our MP, she was vaguely positive, without committing herself, which is what I'd expect from MPs generally, and her in particular. That was before the public debate and press had started to swing our way, too. She told us 'there's already been some push back'.

I suspect they'll find some way to delay again and hope they can put off making a decision indefinitely or until the TRAs forget and go away - they've practically promised them this law change, and in practice it's as if it has happened already in many instances. In order for the vote to go against it, will some individual MPs need to be courageous and stick their heads above the parapet, or can they discuss the party line behind the scenes then quietly shuffle through the right door? If it's going to require courage and integrity from our politicians, we're stuffed.

I think when everyday people see stories like the one of Philip Bunce winning woman awards because apparently to be a woman all you have to do is wear a dress once a week, it's start them thinking that its all getting a little out of hand now and are concerned on how far it will go.

I was out leafleting for Fair Play for Women yesterday & for the first time, people had some idea of what I was talking about. They'd heard about "that rapist who got in the women's prison" or seen something in the paper. It felt really encouraging!

Beupstanding I love that! Will be pondering that one all day.
I also thought/think the tide is turning although now I'm pondering the waves are just getting bigger as Beupstanding suggests.

I think the tide is turning, but it won't happen overnight. It's interested me that a couple of my FB friends who previously used to post stuff that was very sympathetic to the trans cause are now gender-critical. And it's because of stuff like being told they were transphobic for discussing periods or other equally ridiculous stuff. A lot of the TRA campaigning is counter-productive: they try to silence debate by the use of extreme aggression and intimidation, and while that works up to a point, it doesn't work entirely. You just need a few brave people to stand up and speak out and others will follow.

I think that articles in the mainstream press, such as yesterday's interview with Agnes in the Mail on Sunday, also help a lot.

Oh, and the business about the billboard and the attempt to sabotage the Woman's Place UK meeting last week has peak transed a few people. The desire to silence women is something that has a lot of historical resonance.

I strongly believe most people are on our side. You only have to spend 5 minutes researching this issue to realise how aggressive and narcissistic some genderists are.

I think Jess Bradley/Aimee Challoner and Karen White have helped our cause enormously and people like Helen with the Guiding issue and Posie are helping other women feel brave enough to come out.

Whether the government will play silly buggers and drive the changes to the GRA through anyway, I don't know. They do seem determined to do so.

I say we wait to see how the consultation goes and then we start campaigning in earnest to repeal the GRA once and for all. Not to be mean, not to harm trans people but because you cannot change sex and it harms women for the law to say you can. Enough of this nonsense now. Women are saying 'no'

The public have simply been unaware. It's not a tide turning, it's people waking up.

I really hope so.

I swing from feeling really hopeful to close to despair. But it does seem as though there's been a gain in momentum this week. And if that's the case we can't afford to be complacent.

Almost everyone I speak to knows nothing about it - and I think this is the real problem. Once they do know, many get it very quickly

The public have simply been unaware. It's not a tide turning, it's people waking up.

Yes. People are realising that this affects everyone, not just a few "man-hating feminists" online.

The public have simply been unaware. It's not a tide turning, it's people waking up
yes and I am getting more courageous about talking about it. Only one negative response so far :)

I also think the Conservatives will fudge and put off.

Whatever happens, there will be such a bad backlash against LGB. TRA don't give a fuck who goes under the bus with this. I think people like Peter Tatchel need to start talking openly about the risks, I do not for one moment think he doesn't understand. He's a very intelligent man. I saw him mentioning Ireland the other day, leaving out USA and Canada. I just thought he was being very duplicitous.

LittleLebowski I never see any pro trans mentioning Canada and USA where its a a fucking shambles after selfID. Ireland gets mentioned a lot, but Ireland has an appalling record on women rights. Also I suspect, it got through under the radar in these countries that get mentioned.

What we do have here in the UK are many examples from USA and Canada of the real life impact. In fact we are getting many examples here of the impact too.

In my darker moments think this could start a civil war sometimes, if peoples children get taken into care because they will not affirm GI ( which is being proposed in Canada), God knows what will happen.

If it does go through and people see that they have been lied to about it being " just an admin change" it will be really bad.

charlie I’d love to know too ;)