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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Sex as a spectrum

43 replies

truthnothate · 30/09/2018 01:06

A RL friend came up with the "sex is a spectrum" argument. I had a feeling this spectrum wasn't going to look very impressive so I made a picture. The bar is shaded red/yellow/blue according to the proportion female/ambiguous/male sex.

Sex as a spectrum
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truthnothate · 30/09/2018 11:06

I’m not sure even those with true hermaphroditism produce both gametes though?
From what I've read, fertility of either sort is possible but rare among a condition that is rare to start with. So probably unlikely, and if it was possible for an individual in modern medicine it's likely one system or other would have been removed before puberty anyway to help the person develop as normally as possible in whichever was deemed the most appropriate sex.

It also means I have to talk about it in a way which sometimes makes it sound like a ‘look at this fascinating specimen’ rather than people.
I know what you mean, I was feeling the same posting this stuff. It's interesting because of what it tells us about how the human body works, but we mustn't lose sight of the difficult personal impact of having these conditions.

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TheSteveMilliband · 30/09/2018 11:33

Candidpeel that's hilarious! So much cod science, though was he not shown up for talking about the YO intersex people (a karyotype that doesn't exist as it is entirely incompatible with life even at the cellular level)

GatheringHerBrows · 30/09/2018 11:44

Bowl, I don't think that's true re fetal cells persisting in the mother after birth. Cell free fetal (cff) DNA is present in the mother's venous blood, but this disappears in a matter of hours after birth (so, presumably it's constantly being released into and cleared from the blood during pregnancy).

PosieRulzOk · 30/09/2018 12:38

I picked up somewhere that foetal cells from a first pregnancy can be incorporated somehow into a second pregnancy certainly the NIPT test tests these cells in the mothers blood during pregnancy from 10/11 weeks.

Barracker · 30/09/2018 13:03

Gathering I've definitely read of male DNA found incorporated into the mother's brain years after pregnancy.
I'd have to Google but I'm sure I've seen this more than once.

catkind · 30/09/2018 13:06

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchimerism
Haven't checked the references in detail but this looks real gathering? Or have I misunderstood something?

Barracker · 30/09/2018 13:08

<a class="break-all" href="https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=www.sciencenews.org/blog/growth-curve/children%25E2%2580%2599s-cells-live-mothers&ved=2ahUKEwjHx7WU2OLdAhULBsAKHSTkC1gQFjACegQIDBAP&usg=AOvVaw21iod4GQsma3-cfTWB2x55" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=www.sciencenews.org/blog/growth-curve/children%25E2%2580%2599s-cells-live-mothers&ved=2ahUKEwjHx7WU2OLdAhULBsAKHSTkC1gQFjACegQIDBAP&usg=AOvVaw21iod4GQsma3-cfTWB2x55

BrownPaperTeddy · 30/09/2018 13:19

I do wonder if there isn't some kind of chemical influence on our brains that influences our views of self?

Given that everything within our brain is a result of chemical or electrical reactions is it not possible that our view of ourselves happens in the same way?

So depression is a form of a chemical imbalance in the brain, treated with anti depressants.

Why does someone with anorexia see themselves as being fat when all evidence proves the opposite? What stops their brain from recognising the true situation and instead reinforcing a belief?

Is it not possible that a feeling of being born into the wrong body ie the physical body not matching the inner feeling is an imbalance occuring within the brain?

Have any studies looked into this?

Politelygiveszerofucks · 30/09/2018 13:21

Sexuality is a spectrum. Sex isn’t.

GatheringHerBrows · 30/09/2018 13:53

Thanks catkind and Barracker (Barracker, I couldn't get your link to work though). cff DNA is now tested diagnostically, so I don't believe that any DNA from previous pregnancies can persist within the mother's venous blood. I'm not sure about brains though, and I probably don't have time to go to the primary literature at the mo.

GatheringHerBrows · 30/09/2018 13:54

Although there are references on PubMed about this, I see now 😄.

JellySlice · 30/09/2018 14:03

BrownPaperTeddy that is why self ID is such a bad idea. Gender identity issues must be medically evaluated and investigated before any irreversible steps are taken.

The AWA TRAs are not gender-dysphoric, and their campaign harms both genuinely dysphoric and genuinely confused people, not 'just' women, children and vulnerable people of both sexes.

JellySlice · 30/09/2018 14:04

Thanks for the clearer images, truthnothate.

Ekphrasis · 01/10/2018 21:37

I was reading this thread yesterday and posted this link on another website, and was re reading - just for info regarding the cells persisting idea: "microchimerism".

"There’s also something called microchimerism, where cells from each pregnancy remain in a woman’s body and then make their way into subsequent foetuses. This could mean that all younger siblings contain a few cells of their elders"

fairplayforwomen.com/chromosomes-biological-sex-gender/

Ekphrasis · 01/10/2018 21:44

OT but Really fascinating stuff. I read once that breasts evolved as or from part of the immune system so I wonder if there's a reason there (plus why cells have been found in breast tissue).

Turph · 01/10/2018 21:52

Regarding microchimerism, incels are convinced this means men who settle down with non-virgins are being "cucked" as their own offspring might have the DNA of the mother's previous lovers.
The only tests I could find were concerning fruit flies. (Even 4channers will laugh off the above!) Just for info.

Ekphrasis · 02/10/2018 06:31

Jesus

Ekphrasis · 02/10/2018 10:19

So does this thing not exist? Is FairPlay for w wrong in that article?

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