Guardian: LGBT activists criticise minister for women over trans comments

[HavingALittleBabyToolshed]

www.theguardian.com/society/2018/aug/27/lgbt-activists-victoria-atkins-minister-women-trans-comments?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

The minister for women has been condemned by transgender campaigners for saying that young people are having their gender reassigned as “an answer to questions they are perhaps not asking themselves”.

Victoria Atkins cited an increase in the number of teenagers who were being referred to undergo gender reassignment surgery and declared: “We need to get down to the reasons why this is happening.”

The remarks provoked criticism from leading LGBT rights activists who said it was “damaging to imply that trans teens are being given treatment lightly”.

Whilst it is true that many young people with mental health problems (anxiety, depression other psychiatric conditions) have contemplated suicide, and some go on to try and unfortunately succeed, and that risk of suicide must be a priority when treating anybody), the 45% statistic is flawed. Also to be borne in mind that threat of suicide is possibly something encouraged in online forums in order to gain access to treatment which might otherwise not be in the patient's best interests.

This is a good explanation of where the 45% came from:
www.transgendertrend.com/the-suicide-myth/

(see in particular the emails to and from the researchers if you scroll down).

and another here:
www.transgendertrend.com/a-scientist-reviews-transgender-suicide-stats/

I have also emailed Victoria Atkins asking her not to retract or apologise in any way.

I think it's totally bizarre that The Guardian are running this while not mentioning other events of last week.
I find myself feeling very curious about who their financial backers are now.

Sturdy
I am the same. I no longer worry about causing offence or being called a bigot. It got to the stage where it felt so oppressive that I couldn’t stand it anymore!

I know that my views are reasoned and compassionate to all and so I have no fear of speaking out. Online extremists would have people believe that I am a serial killer for saying TWANW, for wanting access to some sex segregated provision to be determined by sexed bodies and to think that a watchful waiting approach to dealing with confused young people is the way to go.

IRL, since speaking up, I have had some awkward conversations but have yet to have anyone scream bigot or transphobe and do the RL equivalent of blocking me. I have had some people get upset at my views, but after discussion (basically them unable to explain what is so awful about what I’m saying) I’ve had everyone say fair enough, bar 2 people. 1 of these said ‘I’ll agree to disagree’ the other cried and said we shouldn’t talk of it again.

I really think it is time people stopped feeling scarred of expressing considered views. We have been brain washed in to thinking this is risky but those trying to shut us up.

Spofs: fox is xx and owl is xy.

I missed the comments being made in the first place so this criticism has just given them more publicity, which is great. The only way you can disagree with this is by avowing a belief in gender identity as fixed from birth. This criticism by Fox and Owl totally shows that people suffering sex dysphoria are not in any way the focus of trans activist campaigning.

Also stop with 'LGBT campaigners' - it's not true. Stop calling them that. They're transactivists, that's all.

Also note that Atkins is junior minister for "safeguarding and vulnerability" so this is right bang smack in the middle of her portfolio.

Full Fact on the 45% suicide statistic (scroll down as it's part of their Question Time coverage that mentioned it).

Good to hear that the minister for women sounds reasonable and rational even on the basis of guardian reporting.

It looks like she gave an interview to the Telegraph on this, I can't read it as I've got an adblocker but may be interesting to see what that says?

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/08/26/womens-minister-cautious-number-teenagers-undergoing-gender/

Gosh is that the sound of a government minister actually DOING THEIR JOB.

Heaven help us in 2018.

Juells

Would it be legitimate to run newspaper articles criticising a minister for expressing concern about anoerexia among teenage girls? Citing people with a vested interest.

It's so evangelical. Not only do you want to transition yourself, but you want your decision to be validated by persuading everyone else that it's the best thing possible for teenagers as well.

Thanks for framing so well exactly what I've been dwelling on this past few days.

My anger at the Guardian knows no bounds.
Dead silence about an enormous safeguarding scandal - which makes us ask questions about the whole premise of "self-ID."
They're worse than any of the "red top" papers.
Hyper-partisan, borderline propaganda, and even more dangerous than the Mail because they're cloaked in "respectability."
Fuck them.

I tried to email the Guardian yesterday re coverage of the Challenor case. It was impossible to find a Contact Us link on their app. until I found one elsewhere. Then they wanted me to create a dedicated new email account just for communicating with them, and download an encryptor. It was all so difficult that I couldn’t bear to pursue it. I hope it wasn’t a deliberate tactic.

One, if not the most important reason the Guardian angled its story like it did was that the Minister made these remarks in a feature for the Daily Telegraph this morning. It was part of an ongoing series and campaign the paper is running on issues concerning women on everything from business to (today's subject) diversity. So, it was obvious the tardy Guardian was going to have to find a way of dissing its more right wing competitor as well as seizing another opportunity to push its trans friendly agenda.

It is noticeable that the DT is angling after a bigger women's market. For example, for a long while now it has covered more women's sport than any other newspaper and has argued for parity in that field.

The front page article can be found at

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/08/26/womens-minister-cautious-number-teenagers-undergoing-gender/

and the full diversity feature at

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/08/27/victoria-atkins-interviewwe-much-better-place-were-tories-move/

Sorry if that sounds like a plug for a newspaper that many MNers would not expect to read, but it is far more female friendly now than the Guardian (not that that is difficult....)

Email sent. I saw a guardian journalist tweet Susie Green for her thoughts on this article. I asked him if his paper had covered David Challenor, Aimee Challenor and the green party story yet.

This is the Guardian's twitter feed on the published article referred to in the OP.

mobile.twitter.com/guardian/status/1033866851611303941

Naturally, there are those commenting on the lack of the Guardian to cover the horrific case of paedophile and rapist David Challenor, and the connections to the Green Party.

That Twitter feed has made my day. Shame on the Guardian

The comments on that article are excellent.

Excellent comments on that Twitter thread.

The Twitter comments are great. If anyone wants to complain to the Guardian about the article, you can email the readers editor, Paul Chadwick, at [email protected].

I agree with every poster - the effect of this dogma and the push to permanent medical and surgical ‘affirmation’ rather that psychological support is that the child’s right to an open future is being removed.

Kids should be able to expect normal adult physical (and sexual) functioning and good health, normal sexual physical development and psychological well-being and normal adult emotional maturation.

This is being removed by the rush to permanent medical and surgical ‘affirmation’ and Victoria Atkins is absolutely right that we need to get down to the root of why this is happening. To girls and young women especially because their presentation has risen so rapidly and sharply.

The rights of children in general and safeguarding principles in general are both being undermined by this TRA dogma.

And that social transition, frequently occurring without the input of mental health professionals, endorsed and encouraged by schools etc, will inevitably lead to pursuing medical transition further down the line.

Guardian have now run the story

www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/27/greens-rising-star-quits-deputy-leader-race-after-father-jailed-for

No comments section underneath

I see the Guardian has run an article - centering AC and the Green Party leadership elections, rather than the rape and torture of a child.

Yeah...

@Latinista you can email the Guardian Readers Editor directly with complaints about content. You need to link it to the part of the editorial code you feel has been broken. Details including email address are here:

www.theguardian.com/info/2014/sep/12/-sp-how-to-make-a-complaint-about-guardian-or-observer-content