The GRA reform and women being consulted

[amekyras]

There was literally a consultation. The consultation is still up, I believe. You can go respond to it right now. How can you say women aren't being consulted? And the women's refuges, most of whom already support transgender women, are also fine with it, judging from the responses to the Scottish GRA consultation that have already been published.

Yeah, you might want to actually read the many threads which already talk about the difference between asking the opinion of agency professionals who rely on certain funding, and asking actual service users.

But please, do tell me how wrong women are, we do all enjoy that so much.

So when the summary of individual GRA responses is published, do you think that will provide a clearer look?

I'm guessing individual responses will be truthful, rather than organisations who seem to be toeing the party line so as not to lose funding. Whether they're published or not, I can't guess, but I expect the lack of financial influence may make a difference to individual's views.

Money talks.

Not really, given how well the TRAs are gaming the system and have been for some time.

When a creep like Jess Bradley has the ear of government and TRAs are merrily declaring their intention to remove sex as a protected characteristic and replace it with gender identity, I have very little faith in the process, and even less good will towards someone who comes here and starts a thread saying "You're all worried about nothing and everyone disagrees with you".

Judging by the amount of complaining on this board, and the amount of people posting their own responses to the GRA consultation, everybody who cares has definitely been consulted.

You're right Floral I feel all comforted now the OP has corrected my warped view of the world.

amekyras, well, that's us told then. You can probably fuck off back to head in the sand land now you've so comprehensively dismissed any and all specific concerns, eh?

Cor. I think someone's been bottling things up.

I feel like I've walked into one of those conversations that go

you've put an empty milk bottle back in the fridge you utter fucking bastard

er what?

did you sleep with my sister?

Judging by the amount of complaining on this board, and the amount of people posting their own responses to the GRA consultation, everybody who cares has definitely been consulted.

Have they? Try stopping 100 random women in the street and ask them if they know about the consultation.

On this thread, there are people saying that they knew nothing about the Scottish consultation earlier this year, even though they live in Scotland.

I am certain that the vast majority of people in the country know nothing about this.

Having responded to a number of government "consultations" over some years, I can confidently say that they tend to be entirely for show.

Women who think letting people self-id won't affect them are either delusional, haven't bothered to read and think it through or belong to the 'I don't think it will affect me personally, therefore I don't care' schools.

The last group are especially delusional, because it WILL affect them - and in ways they will seriously regret.

I am certain that the vast majority of people in the country know nothing about this.

I'm very well educated and well read. I knew nothing of these issues less than a year ago. I've introduced several similarly well educated and well read friends who knew nothing about it in recent months.

And then there's the millions of other women I haven't spoken to...

Maybe we're dealing with the radicalisation portal paradox, where MN is simultaneously both responsible for the persecution of all the transpeople and just a handful of whiny, powerless women?

If the problem is that the consultation doesn't have enough publicity, I'd agree. It definitely needs more awareness. We also need to tell people what the reforms will actually do - allow 16 and 17 year olds gender recognition, allow non-binary recognition, and allow Self-ID, which just means that trans people can get a GRC more easily, which simply allows them to change their birth certificate. That's it. Nothing else. Trans women can use the women's bathrooms without a GRC, and that's not going to change. The EA is not being reformed.

OP, it will change the scope of the EA by altering who can legally be a woman. Legal analysis at docs.google.com/document/d/1b7viOWsx-Wgw344fujX3QddaJN8d4JKJoaVhyzMz1so/mobilebasic and also at Fair Play For Women.

Yes, but the EA relies upon a definition of 'woman' which is being reformed

So actually the EA kinda is being reformed

If you're in good faith and actually asking questions rather than just trying to make a point, check out this thread
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3343275-legal-take-down-of-proposed-changes-to-the-gra-by-barrister-julian-norman

amekyras

Tell me - who ARE "trans people"? How are they defined at present?

How will self-id change that definition, do you think?

I must have woken up with my cynic button stuck on 'complete', because I'm seeing 'literally' in the OP, appeals to dodgy authority, rehashing the same minimising 'factoids' about the implications of self ID, and the ever helpful reminder of the toilet issue which nearly every GC poster here has said is the very, very least of the issues.

It's okay Floral

The OP SAYS it will be okay, so it will be.

pats Floral on head and mutters "there there"

Is it time to start talking about Weetabix?

Can we make it doughnuts? I like doughnuts. Lemon Curd Doughnuts. I may have mentioned them before, once or twice....

As long as we stay off vodka, gin etc with hideously sweet things steeped in them.

Otherwise, go for it.

(Realises has appointed self as thread comestible police officer)

I've got a hangover today so have so far consumed

Cheese and onion crisps
Pointless healthy cereal bar
Sashimi
Box of cherries
Family sized bag of cinema sweet popcorn (food of the gods)
Large bar of orange chocolate

You may now boggle at the sheer number of calories that have gone down my gullet

Starting to feel human though

You managed raw fish with a hangover?

Kudos.

That is impressive.

That doc is very interesting. I still assert that the EA2010 is not directly changing, and that the organisations affected mainly by the single sex exemptions already accept transgender women, and I actually find it hilarious that you think there's no way they could be doing so out of basic human decency, that there has to be a financial motive, despite you having no proof of this, if I remember correctly.

I:

• Went to the gym and did an hour on the treadmill first thing.
• Came back and had some berries and Greek yoghurt for breakfast.
• Had two small pieces of pumpernickel bread, a piece of cheese and some cherries for lunch.
• Am a bit of a smug bugger.

NB Can I recommend Morrison's pumpernickel bread (loaf or rolls, you get 4 rolls for a quid)? It's fabulous.