Dr Christian Jessen - problem with feminists or just controversial?

[heresyandwitchcraft]

One thing you may have noticed is that Dr Jessen sometimes appears to hold views that are diametrically opposed to many feminists on this board. Other people have alleged that he has a tendency to dismiss women more on Twitter, and it's therefore difficult to discuss these with him. So I have collected some of Dr Jessen's controversies here, in case anyone wants to talk about them.

Please make up your own mind, and have a look at the sources:

- a Twitter exchange with another Dr about whether child brides (aged 12) are acceptable in other countries

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3245071-To-be-disgusted-that-Dr-Christian-Jessen-considers-some-kinds-of-child-rape-to-be-morally-excusable-on-cultural-grounds
twitter.com/doctorchristian/status/711205104511295490?lang=en

-Tweeted: "Any lawyers explain why age of consent is 16 (implied that too immature to consent if younger) but age of criminal responsibility is 10?!"

twitter.com/DoctorChristian/status/712996773417975809

- Tweeting: "Glad to hear leading child protection officer Simon Bailey talking sense saying paedophiles should be rehabilitated, and not always jailed"

www.thesun.co.uk/news/2991248/embarrassing-bodies-dr-christian-jessen-sparks-twitter-rage-as-he-backs-cop-who-said-dont-jail-low-risk-paedophiles/

- Tweeted: "No I don't think paedophilia is a choice like I don't think homosexuality is a choice. And yes I have used both words in the same sentence!"

twitter.com/doctorchristian/status/537986446070906880?lang=en-gb

- Said that kids should watch pornography in sex-ed in schools
This is a quote by Dr Jessen from a Telegraph article:
Make kids cringe and squirm. I think it'd be very helpful in sex education to show the distinction between porn and sex as you have it. Most parents won't have the gumption, but at school that could be a good lesson. Not full-on porn, but images, for example, and then they could discuss whether that's a good thing or not. Get them to watch this video of a man being fairly aggressive to a woman in porn and talk about that. Parents would be in outcry, but so what?

www.telegraph.co.uk/health-fitness/body/dr-christian-jessen-showing-pornography-schools-would-helpful/
twitter.com/telegraph/status/990513708563656704?lang=en

- Tweeted: "1) Terrible story of cabby accused of rape by female passenger only 2b saved by his recording of journey where nothing of the sort happened." And then allegedly proceeded to argue with women who challenged him. He has since deleted the second part of the thread which allegedly read: 2)Why do women do this?! 2 many rape cases ignored, so why try this sort of damaging nonsense on to make it worse? Loons.

twitter.com/DoctorChristian/status/353088718413905920
glosswatch.com/2013/07/06/dr-christian-jessen-rape-tweets-and-context-some-thoughts/
everydayvictimblaming.com/media-complaints/dr-christian-jessen-spreading-rape-myths/

- got into Twitter arguments when his show Supersize vs Superskinny was accused of being triggering to survivors of eating disorders, and Dr Jessen allegedly not showing enough sympathy on that issue

twitter.com/ilonacatherine/status/299129838365728768
sabotagetimes.com/tv-film/supersize-vs-superskinny-triggering-dangerous-morally-bankrupt
unsafespaces.com/2013/03/23/the-trouble-with-dr-jessen/

As a friendly community reminder I appreciate there are controversial views out there. I have merely collated these in the interest of discussion.

The last point isn't really about philosophical disagreements - it's included only because it came up when I Googled Dr Jessen controversy:
Dr Jessen did once have to meet with Channel 4 after allegedly posting explicit messages referencing drug use. He has since denied any wrongdoing: He started talking about getting some drugs and I told him not to buy any because it sounded like he was going to get ripped off but we didn't ever meet him and no drugs were taken.

www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/455910/christian-jessen-tv-doctor-harley-st-clinic
www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3167233/Dr-Christian-Jessen-defends-inviting-stranger-flat-drug-fuelled-romp.html

Its weird that he is so clued up about health dogmas but so clueless about puberty, and how its not normal for adult men to want sex with children.

I don’t know how he has got away with saying children should watch porn in sex Ed, it’s an offence to show a child pornography.
Next stop for the liberal idiots will be to legalise forms of paedophila, just look at sympathy for James Gunn from celebrities.....
and anyone calling for him to be sacked is “far right”

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/01/james-gunn-alt-right-marvel-film-director-tweets

But hey what’s a few jokes about rape and paedophila! He sent thousands, media defends him, it’s disgusting.

He comes across as very petulant to me, with more than a tad of arrogance and a sprinkling of smarm.

Quite an unappetising recipe.

Reading through that has made me feel a little queasy. Paedophilia isn't a choice, well maybe not, but I imagine some psychopathic axe murderers would say that their overwhelming need to main or kill wasn't a choice either. Doesn't mean we let them do it.

I don't whether he thinks he's being clever or controversial but he just comes over as rather dim. When his craven stupidity and illogical thought process is pointed out he gets hissy and rude. Much like his chums in the club hut (sorry Twitter).

I think he infringes the spirit if not the letter of the GMC code of conduct somewhat.

Looking at some of the behaviour of doctors on social media we've been seeing over the past year or so, I'm beginning to wonder whether there's an inherent conflict of interest between practicising as a doctor and seeking a media career.

He's smarmy and something "off' about his demeanour, his looks and his behaviour imo

I imagine he thinks women are pretty irrelevant to his life.

Male is default in medicine, so male is default in his professional life. He is gay so his personal life is (presumably) dominated by male relationships.

My assumption was that he thinks vagina and womb owners are just annoying abberances, and it would really be better if they just shut up and pissed off.

Ive come across plenty of doctors who are crazy misogynistic and find the female body - with all its weird differences to men - almost a personal insult to their education. He simply has a wider platform to shout his views from.

His face looks the way peoples faces look when I have a migraine.

Not

Yes. I think he's had all sorts of no-surgical procedures. Ironically, botox is used to treat migraine

I am not going to condone attacks on looks here, especially for someone who says they suffer with body dysmorphia.
I will agree that there is an attitude and a behaviour towards women that seems to have been commented on in other places.
Breastfeeding controversy:
I'm confused at how me objecting to him using statements such as "breastapo" and "militants" is proving his point beautifully, I wasn't rude or aggressive at any point. But I can't see the point in asking - logic and reason doesn't appear to the main feature of this Doctor's replies!
Rape comment controversy:
According to Jessen any woman who disagrees with him is an "aggressive feminist". Well, no wonder consider the level of ignorance Jessen displays. Instead of thinking about what he wrote and considering if whether or not what he wrote was offensive, Jessen went straight to abusive whining.
And
Christian Jessen might have sufficient support to enable him to adopt some imaginary moral high ground from which he’s just stating the facts but this isn’t the reality. The real world as experienced by rapists, rape survivors and false allegation survivors is somewhat different. It’s a world that’s shaped not just by deeds but by the words and responses of others. Before suggesting those who disagree with him are mentally deficient, Jessen would do well to remember this.

And when it came to eating disorders being triggered by his show:

Many take to Twitter to vent their frustrations at Supersize vs Superskinny, branding it as triggering and dangerous. Doctor Christian is always quick to defend Supersize vs Superskinny, usually by referring to viewing figures (and the fact that I'm still watching). But viewing figures tell us fuck all about morals. Dr C and Emma Woolf might joke between themselves about this stuff, but that just proves to me, and should to everyone else, that that's how much they care about those who are actually affected by this programme. It's pretty sad really, and not in the way they intend it to be.

And

However, I’m saddened that it happened at the instigation of a fellow healthcare professional. I’m even more saddened that the brunt of it was also caught by someone who has lived experience of one of the very conditions that Dr Jessen talks about in his show.

Dr Jessen seems rather unrepentant about all this.

Yes, you are probably right. His troubles haven't given him empathy but one should take the high road

Daddy issues? Hard time during teens because he was gay? Maybe abused himself as a child?

Still a women hating arse though.

I'm like Betty, I know him mostly for his terrible "advice" on breastfeeding, which came out when I was bfing my own DCs and volunteering as a peer supporter.

Whatever one thinks about breastfeeding, Dr C's pronouncements were completely out of order - not based on any evidence, contrary to WHO guidelines and completely unhelpful.

Creepy woman hater.

I just keep wondering how showing a child pornographic images in school would not be in direct contravention of the law. Again, I understand that porn, & porn vs reality should be talked about, but why show kids explicit material in class?

This is how the NSPCC talks about Child sexual abuse:

Involves forcing or enticing a child or young person to take part in sexual activities, not necessarily involving a high level of violence, whether or not the child is aware of what is happening.
...
They may also include non-contact activities, such as involving children in looking at, or in the production of, sexual images, watching sexual activities, encouraging children to behave in sexually inappropriate ways, or grooming a child in preparation for abuse (including via the internet).

www.nspcc.org.uk/preventing-abuse/child-abuse-and-neglect/child-sexual-abuse/legislation-policy-guidance/

I have to say most of the gay men I have known, not a huge amount but 10 or so, apart from one or two, were misogynists. They often tried to act like they weren't - but outed themselves pretty quickly when under pressure or stressed.

The way my sex-ed teacher covered it was really good. She had the boys and the girls talk about sex expectations from a partner. Invariably, the girls brought up things like being funny and kind, and the guys wanted a woman who was always "up for it" and "tasted good."
And then she asked them about things like whether they felt the woman should be forced to do things in order to "taste good" or should be made to engage in sexual acts if she wasn't actually that into it. It was really eye-opening, and got the whole class talking about stuff. When the guys realized they were talking about REAL WOMEN, not some fantasy/porn thing, then it did help. To be fair, this was before the ubiquity of internet porn, but I still think there are ways of making these points without having to watch it.

Indeed I could. Gladly. And hopefully you’ll learn something. A woman (XX is how I expect your blinkered binary vision would call her) can have a penis if she has the SRY gene on her X chromosome. That’s just one way out of many. See? Learning is fun! 😁 t.co/xpgavT02EK

Patronising (and wrong)

I would say that at the least, he being disingenuous and dismissive of that woman. How is this helpful in the long run for sexual education (you know, who can get pregnant, and who can't, etc)?

This gene stuff isn’t my strong point (Babel, help a sister out?) but an XX SRY person is a man, not a woman, no?

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/XX_male_syndrome

So, Dr C, not a ‘woman with a penis’

I thought people with chromosomal/intersex conditions preferred to be excluded from the self-id conversation - ? So he's either using that argument out of ignorance or to muddy the waters, neither of which is very helpful.

I mean, the abstracts on Science Direct seem to talk about XX males being MALE, with a phenotype that ranges from typical male to somewhat ambiguous genitalia. But again, it's an intersex condition and not really relevant to the trans debate. Even the Intersex Society of North America has said that trans and intersex aren't the same thing.

However, playing along, an XX male in adulthood would fit the definition of an "adult human male" = men, correct?

Also, apparently
The frequency of XX males is approximately 1 in 25,000 males.

www.sciencedirect.com/topics/medicine-and-dentistry/xx-male-syndrome

Many people confuse transgender and transsexual people with people with intersex conditions because they see two groups of people who would like to choose their own gender identity and sometimes those choices require hormonal treatments and/or surgery. These are similarities. It’s also true, albeit rare, that some people who have intersex conditions also decide to change genders at some point in their life, so some people with intersex conditions might also identify themselves as transgender or transsexual.

In spite of these similarities, these two groups should not be and cannot be thought of as one. The truth is that the vast majority of people with intersex conditions identify as male or female rather than transgender or transsexual. Thus, where all people who identify as transgender or transsexual experience problems with their gender identity, only a small portion of intersex people experience these problems.
www.isna.org/faq/transgender

‘XX male syndrome is a rare cause of Male infertility’

academic.oup.com/humrep/article/16/4/717/3114050

So not only are xx sry people not women with penises, they are also unrelated to the trans debate, and also a disorder causing infertility, rather than proof of a biological sex spectrum.

It’s utterly shit that intersex disorders are appropriated in this way, and even worse, that they are used in a factually incorrect manner by a DOCTOR.