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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Lachlan Stuart on Alex Drummand (Stonewall Advisor on trans)

63 replies

R0wantrees · 07/07/2018 11:04

Lachlan Stewart is a Labour Policy advisor:

"Centering trans voices: Alex in her own words (*1):

… Alex is a lesbian (*2) advisor to Stonewall on trans. If ill, should Alex be admitted to a women's ward in hospitals? entitled to use women's communal showers? perform body searches on women in custody?"

Lachlan Stuart concludes:
"Stonewall has never been a representative or member-based organisation, always a lobby group, necessarily beholden to its funders (mostly government now) and accountable only to its own articles (which have changed since founding)."

twitter.com/Lachlan_Edi/status/1015484266753527809

Lachlan Stuart on Alex Drummand (Stonewall Advisor on trans)
OP posts:
Moonkissedlegs · 07/07/2018 12:50

I know. He could actually make a difference. I guess it's a lot more of a scary thing to do. It's easier to try and coerce women into accepting you the way you are, than men.

Moonkissedlegs · 07/07/2018 12:51

Or i should say it feels like it would be easier to coerce women into accepting him as 'one of them' than men.

TransplantsArePlants · 07/07/2018 12:53

It's so extreme I feel like he's

a) A performance artist
b) A troll
c) Not quite well in the not-having-a-personality-disorder way
d) Really really nasty

UpstartCrow · 07/07/2018 12:58

Sex and orientation are protected characteristics. (unless you are a woman or a lesbian.)

iamawoman · 07/07/2018 12:58

Alex drummond - a bee gee gone wrong

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 07/07/2018 13:01

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Datun · 07/07/2018 13:01

terryleather

Nailed it.

terryleather · 07/07/2018 13:08

Datun

At the risk of sounding like a fan girl, I learned from a master. Thank you Smile

R0wantrees · 07/07/2018 13:12

GIven Lachlan Stuart's stated concerns, I wonder if this has been raised with the Charities Commission or the Minister responsible.

'The Charity Commission is the registrar and regulator of charities in England and Wales. Its role is to provide proportionate regulation to the sector so that the public can trust and have confidence in charities. An independent, non-Ministerial Government Department, it is based across four sites, employing approximately 350 staff and for the financial year 2018/19 has a budget of £27 million. A new, five-year strategic plan will be launched during the summer of 2018.

The Secretary of State for the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (DCMS) appoints the Chair and other Board members, following fair and open competition, regulated by the Office of the Commissioner for Public Appointments.'

publicappointments.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/appointment/charity-commission-board-members-x-3/

OP posts:
Tinycitrus · 07/07/2018 13:22

That’s was like some sort of Chris Morris mockumentary Grin

iamawoman · 07/07/2018 13:26

Totally with you on that terryleather

R0wantrees · 07/07/2018 13:36

twitter.com/bo_novak/status/1015571067425968128

Lachlan Stuart on Alex Drummand (Stonewall Advisor on trans)
OP posts:
Dragoncake · 07/07/2018 14:32

A PM has alerted me to the fact that I got my Ruths muddled upthead.

I meant Ruth Hunt, Chief Exec of Stonewall, not Ruth Davidson, Scottish conservative. Apologies. And thanks for the PM Smile

SingitJane · 07/07/2018 18:49

I've met Alex. She says she prefers female pronouns but didn't object when people slipped up.

She also clearly identifies herself as a transwoman (not as a woman) and genderqueer (between female and male) and even though I don't think that is a 'thing', I don't really object to someone like her saying it. She also is 100% behind 'genderless' third spaces as she feels that makes life easier and safer for everyone.

When I met her I was ready to think she was a narcissistic arsehole and although I don't agree with everything she believes, I felt she wasn't a TRA that is threatening womens rights - she's clear that she's trans in a 'genderqueer' way and not a woman.

As a very good Psychotherapist I can't imagine her insisting that traumatised women be forced to share female spaces with male bodied people (which she recognises she is). She recognises her male biology but wants her GI to be related to her 'personality', which she feels is more female. Willing to be corrected if I'm wrong however as I only spent a couple of hours with her.

That video of her makes her look like a twat and I think she might regret it.

I also surreptitiously watched her go to the loo in the mens but maybe that was due to the event we were at and she doesn't normally?

To be honest, I'm not nervous or angered by TW like her. She says she feels like a woman but recognises she isn't one, she's trans or GQ. She doesn't want to be discriminated against by being a TW or GQ which is fair enough.

Many will disagree with me but I don't object much to TW like her. She seems to be saying 'I feel like a woman but don't claim to be one'. If all TRAs were like that, there wouldn't be much of a problem.

Like a previous poster said; If you feel like a woman and want to be called she (as a preference rather than a demand) and challenge gender stereotypes and wear eyeshadow with your beard, knock yourself out.

Moonkissedlegs · 07/07/2018 18:59

Many will disagree with me but I don't object much to TW like her. She seems to be saying 'I feel like a woman but don't claim to be one'. If all TRAs were like that, there wouldn't be much of a problem.

Well if that's the case then Alex needs to get that YouTube video taken down. It's full of such damaging stereotypes, Alex claims to be a 'lesbian' and says that want to 'widen the bandwidth of woman'. I think all those things are damaging to women.

If that is not the message that Alex is giving, then they need to rethink how they are coming across. I think Alex comes across as an alright person, but the message they are sending is all wrong (IMO)

SingitJane · 07/07/2018 19:08

Oh yeah the video is bollocks and offensive and not at all how she comes across in RL nor what she seems to actually say in RL. Her lectures are more representative to be honest.

I also don't believe for a second she didn't know what TG is until her 40s but didn't think I could say that after a few hours at a professional conference!

terryleather · 07/07/2018 19:30

Here's the thing, AD wants to have their male entitlement cake and eat it too.

AD has no idea what it feels like to be female because female is not a feeling in a man's head and personalities are not male and female.

If AD was just going about their business widening the bandwidth of being male then I'd maybe agree with what you say (and I appreciate you have some insider perspective having met AD) but that's not what appears to be going on here...

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 07/07/2018 20:10

More and more I think from a very, very young age children start getting a sense of what's acceptable behaviour for boys and girls, men and women. They know which they are because of their anatomy. I can easily see how in the mind of a preschooler 'I-don't-feel-like-everybody-seems-to-think-a-boy-should-feel' could turn into 'I-don't-feel-like-everybody-seems-to-think-a-boy-should-feel-so-I-must-be-the-other-thing-which-is-a-girl'.

I find it particularly odd that a psychotherapist can't see this.

SingitJane · 07/07/2018 20:11

Oh I agree with the 'bandwith' comment. That pissed me off immensely.

Personally, I think Alex IS doing more to widen the bandwidth of 'male' and wish she said that. Because that's what she does. She believes (and says) that anger and hatred often results from people feeling they're being conned in some way or treated as if they're stupid or it is demanded that they pretend something is true when it is a lie. So she says there is no such internal battle when people meet her.

Yes, she feels female and prefers female pronouns but wears what she recognises as stereotypically female clothes (but not sexually overt ones) and make up on an obviously male body. She isn't trying to 'pass' or pretend to be a biological female and insist people believe she is or treat her as a woman. She's trans, she is GQ. She isn't trying to fool anyone. She is who she is and knows that no-one will confuse her with, or feel pressured to treat her as a woman. Because although she 'feels' like one, she knows she is biologically male and pretending she isn't would provoke negative reactions from men and women.

She hasn't posted on her Twitter for about a year which does make me wonder if it's because she wants to not be called to support TRA she doesn't agree with (or I might be making that up!) but in the 1000s of tweets before that there are no tweets suggesting any TRA activity that I could object to. Other than a couple of mentions of being friends with Paris Lees. That disappoints me but I also know I have friends but don't agree with everything they say.

terryleather · 07/07/2018 20:18

I find it particularly odd that a psychotherapist can't see this.

I very much agree Gasp0de, it's a bit concerning..

SingitJane · 07/07/2018 20:23

Gasp - me too, but Alex thinks that young children identified his GQ identity when he was the same age and not necessarily aware of it himself.

In therapy (as all Psychotherapists undergo as part of their training), we can only explore our understanding/opinions of our past and it is exceptionally easy to 'rewrite' it. 'Remember' an event/events repeatedly in therapy and it becomes our 'truth'.

Memory is notoriously unreliable. Eyewitness accounts of crimes and the fragmented memories of trauma are unreliable let alone externally 'implanted' memories that can be harmless (the millions of people who 'remember' Walkers crisps changing colour when it never happened) to more damaging and dangerous 'memories' leading to false confessions and convictions.

I've done it myself.

bakedlikeabun · 07/07/2018 20:36

Lots of references to "she feels female".what does that mean, what does it feel like to feel female, in a way that doesn't involve anything biological?
We need men who want to wear stereotypically feminine clothing etc to own their maleness and not claim to be female or to be trans - now that would really expand the bandwidth.

Datun · 07/07/2018 20:41

Whatever Alex thinks or doesn't think, the only thing they 'do differently' is wear a skirt.

Alex doesn't think like a woman, feel like a woman or live like a woman.

Alex might very well be a thoroughly nice person. I don't doubt it. They don't come across as malicious.

But the words Alex is using to describe their situation are all wrong.

I can't help wondering what is Alex's motivation? Being gynephellic but wearing a skirt would indicate cross dresser.

Alex might just like skirts, but that is a singularly, incredibly one-dimensional reason, to put yourself out there as anything under the trans umbrella.

Alex needs to stop referring to themself as anything 'woman-esque', because they are merely underpinning regressive stereotypes and demonstrating zero affinity with women.

TransplantsArePlants · 07/07/2018 20:44

Alex should have said they want to widen the bandwidth of men. Fine by me

I'd be wary of a psychotherapist who lies

Lottapianos · 07/07/2018 21:13

'AD has no idea what it feels like to be female because female is not a feeling in a man's head and personalities are not male and female'

Yes to this, and for the 20 millionth time, I cannot believe that this needs explaining!

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