is it true?

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if the GRC I think it's called goes ahead that means people will be able to legally access spaces of the gender of which they identify?

The GRC is a gender recognition certificate. I think what you mean is the consultation on the GRA. The consultation is due to start in July. If TRA's have their way people will be able to state they are the opposite gender and access all spaces of that gender. Feminists are opposing this. No decision is expected for a while.

Yes, there is a proposal that people "self identify" their sex and that would mean what you describe

I have to go to bed, I'm sure helpful posters will be along soon but in the meantime you might find this website useful

womansplaceuk.org

but what if this goes ahead and then a man decides to "identify as a woman" for a day so he can go into a woman's private space to perv?

isn't the government putting us at risk if they go ahead with this?

You might find this video interesting OP from Denmark where they already have a version of self ID:

This is why feminists are opposing this. Anyone technically could just wake up and identify how they like and access those spaces. The consultation will include people from all walks of life. We can, at the moment just keep our voices loud, make people aware of this and then see what the Government do. There are groups all over, look at the one linked above. Women are joining together on Twitter, here and in WPUK and WNTT groups.

Yes, if this goes ahead it will be a blow for women and children.

"isn't the government putting us at risk if they go ahead with this?"

Yes, hugely. We've only got to look at upskirting problems.

I really am going to bed, but this is already a problem in many ways as some organisations behave as if it's already happened, so for example, one lady asked for a woman to do her smear test and got a trans woman.

inews.co.uk/news/health/nhs-woman-transgender-nurse-smear-test/

I did hear upskirting photos was going to be a specific offence but it didn't go through

The Government are pushing for upskirting to be an offence so that's some good news. It will take longer than it would have had Choke not stopped it.

The GRA consultation (gender recognition act) is a totally different kettle of fish all together.

See Womans Place UK website for more information. There are many videos of speakers at meetings discussing aspects of this.

womansplaceuk.org

WPUK have 5 demands:

Respectful and evidence-based discussion about the impact of the proposed changes to the Gender Recognition Act to be allowed to take place and for women’s voices to be heard.

The principle of women-only spaces to be upheld – and where necessary extended.

A review of how the exemptions in the Equality Act which allow or single sex services or requirements that only a woman can apply for a job (such as in a domestic violence refuge) are being applied in practice.

Government to consult with women’s organisations on how self-declaration would impact on women-only services and spaces.

Government to consult on how self-declaration will impact upon data gathering – such as crime, employment, pay and health statistics – and monitoring of sex-based discrimination such as the gender pay gap.

THere is a useful thread here with good links and explanations for anyone new to the issues:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

It’s an incredibly complicated argument in lots of ways about the GRA, GRC and self-certification of ‘gender’.

And in lots of ways it’s really simple: sex and ‘gender’ are different and should be treated so in law.

Trans people have the right to live as they wish and be recognised as the gender they believe they are, and be free from unnecessary discrimination whilst doing so. Most people agree with this.

‘Woman’ means person with biological female sex attributes (vagina etc) and ‘Man’ means person with biological male sex attributes (penis etc). Most people also agree with this.

There’s a HUGE and controversial grey area between these where a lot of trans people disagree with the second statement.

Lots of people - women, feminists - are very very concerned.

I'm off to bed, hopefully someone else will post tonight, if not there will be loads of women around tomorrow to help guide you. Night all.

but what if this goes ahead and then a man decides to "identify as a woman" for a day so he can go into a woman's private space to perv?

This concern prompted #ManFriday
"Let’s start with this statement: I am not going to justify women having their own spaces. Thousands of women, some I know, most I don’t, fought the fight for women’s spaces before I was born so that I, and other women in the UK today, don’t have to. Thanks to them, women’s rights, protections, spaces, and services exist to facilitate women’s participation in social life by upholding and protecting our safety, privacy and dignity. Programs and offices reserved for women seek to redress systemic discrimination against women that puts us at a disadvantage compared to our male peers.

If men want to access these spaces, they need a darn good reason. Like the time male paramedics entered the women’s changing room at the gym where I had collapsed due to complications with my first pregnancy. The women in the changing room had a heads-up so that they could get dressed, hide in the loos, leave the changing room or stay there. It was inconvenient but none of the women present minded because my life and the life of my unborn baby were in danger. The circumstances were exceptional, controlled and limited."

manfridayuk.org

You will be able to declare your own sex, and get a certificate that says you are entitled to be treated as if you were the opposite sex. Yes, it means fully male-bodied people entering female spaces like changing rooms, sports etc. Organisations are allowed to offer a single sex space which is TRULY single sex, but they won't have to offer that. They don't even do it now even though they can.

Also it's illegal to ask to see the gender recognition certificate. So if you are trans you don't even have to get one. Trans peeps with penises can just walk into a ladies' swim change with having any medical treatment at all, and if you as a woman challenge them, you could be breaking the law. If you report them it could be harassment or hate crime. So there's total power and control right there.

So that's what is proposed. That's what MPs like Maria Miller and Stella Creasy want to happen. Plus all the male MPs of course, except David TC Davis, Monmouth MP, who thinks it's a dumb idea.

'INTERVIEW: UK women are self-identifying as men to challenge proposed changes to the GRA as part of #ManFriday'

"On Friday, March 16th, Amy Desir and Hannah Clarke attended a men-only swim session at the Dulwich Leisure Centre, wearing only trunks and pink swimming caps. This action was the third of many that followed — part of a nationwide campaign called #ManFriday. Initially formed on Mumsnet, the 100+ women of #ManFriday are using direct action to expose the absurdities and injustices of self-identification and the threat to women’s rights posed by new gender identity legislation. In protest of proposed amendments to the Gender Recognition Act (GRA), which would enable people to self-identify as men or women, UK women are “self-identifying” as men every Friday. Though the UK government held consultations over proposed changes to the GRA, women were not consulted, and the government only spoke with transgender lobby groups. Last month, I spoke with Hannah about this burgeoning political movement and the public reaction, which led to Swim England pulling it’s guidance (which had said trans-identified swimmers should be encouraged to use the changing rooms that make them most comfortable) from the Internet and listing it as “under review.” (interview with Hannah Clarke follows)

www.feministcurrent.com/2018/04/09/interview-uk-women-self-identifying-men-challenge-proposed-changes-gra-part-manfriday/

OP I'm wondering what prompted your question. Was it the incident at Leicester Square station?

It will also impact on child safeguarding, putting children at risk.

It’s extremely worrying

Fair Play for Women have a good page here which outlines the current law and what the proposed changes would mean both legally and in practice.

There is a lot of very good, clear info on their site.

They are currently crowdfunding to launch a major information campaign as the GRA consultation will open very soon and most people are not aware of what's happening.

if the GRC I think it's called goes ahead that means people will be able to legally access spaces of the gender of which they identify?
Well trans people can already access the spaces which they identify under the Equality Act. The changes to the GRA won't change this.

but what if this goes ahead and then a man decides to "identify as a woman" for a day so he can go into a woman's private space to perv?
If the government goes ahead with the system in Ireland, then the man would have to declare in front of a solicitor or other commission for oaths that he intends to live as a women for the rest of his life - with up to 2 years in jail for a false declaration. The maximum penalty for voyeurism itself is only 2 years. However, even if the man obtained a GRC fraudulently under a reformed GRA it would not give him the right to access female spaces.

Yes, it means fully male-bodied people entering female spaces like changing rooms, sports etc
Not the case. For changing rooms see above. For sports both the EA and GRA exclude sports.

Also it's illegal to ask to see the gender recognition certificate.
Not the case. Also completely irrelevant. Under the EA a transwomen does not need a GRC to have a right to use female spaces.

The proposed changes to the GRA are simple administrative changes - they don't affect women's spaces.

What makes you think the Irish system will be brought in?

Racing, the upskirting bill was "supposed" to be going through, it was stopped last minute (as a private members bill can be) by Christopher Chope

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-44513497

Most what you say is misleading Sarahar

It's quite bad actually. If self ID comes in it will make a massive difference to the lives of women and girls.

Hang on SarahAr. How can both these things be true?

Well trans people can already access the spaces which they identify under the Equality Act. The changes to the GRA won't change this.

However, even if the man obtained a GRC fraudulently under a reformed GRA it would not give him the right to access female spaces.

However, even if the man obtained a GRC fraudulently under a reformed GRA it would not give him the right to access female spaces

cf situation in USA

'Shelter forced women to shower with person who identified as a transgender woman and sexually harassed them, lawsuit says'

FRESNO, Calif. (KFSN) -- A prominent Fresno charity, homeless women, and the transgender community all say they're experiencing a nightmare come true.

Nine women homeless women signed on to a lawsuit against Naomi's House and its parent company, the Poverello House, saying the last place they could go to feel safe is now dangerous because they're forced to shower with a transgender woman.

The Naomi House bills itself as a gentle haven of healing and a safe haven for single, homeless women, but a new lawsuit says it put a lot of women in harm's way in a very vulnerable spot -- the shower.

It says the shelter requires them to shower in groups, and it opened its doors to a person who identified themself as a transgender woman who made lewd and sexually inappropriate comments, and leered at them while they were naked.

This is the biggest fear they bring up, that you're going to have people who may not even be transgender in bathrooms and settings where people are naked and their privacy rights are being violated," said Peter Kapetan, who filed the lawsuit on behalf of the women.

Poverello House administrators tell Action News federal law says they have to treat a person identifying as a woman as a woman -- and there's no way to test whether it's true... (continues)

(concludes)
Leaders in the Valley's transgender community tell us this is a nightmare for them too because if someone who calls herself a transgender woman is sexually harassing people, she put an already marginalized community in a bad light.

Karen Adell Scot, a local transgender advocate, even offered to train Naomi's House employees on how to recognize people just pretending to identify as the opposite gender.

One possible solution is already in place: Poverello House administrators say they added shower curtains about four months ago.

The lawsuit is due for a hearing in August."

Discussed in thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3266198-No-True-Transwoman-transadvocates-question-whether-TW-is-genuine-after-said-TW-sexually-harasses-women-in-homeless-shelter

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