Anyone have any idea how acceptable to the "general population" the common sense/pragmatic approach to transgender and women/girls rights would be?

[loveyouradvice]

I realise this calls for total speculation - but would be interested in what you think... given that all of us know that most people are very unaware that this debate is even happening, or are just beginning to become aware but have no idea that it might affect them.... and there is equally the challenge of a very undefined "transpopulation" extending from occasional cross-dressers to transsexuals

At the moment, when transgender rights increase they often diminish the rights of girls and women ....
In some situations, a third "space" is being created or mooted as a solution.
Although I recognise that this would not fulfil the desire for validation, would this not work for protecting and supporting transpeople without meaning that girls and women lose out?
is it not the pragmatic compromise between both sides that people are questing for and one that "most" people would think reasonable- and if not, why not?

eg:

1. Physical spaces: toilets, changing rooms, sleeping quarters: male, female and unisex (as recently adopted by the BBC, and recently quoted as happening in one Scottish youth hostel).
2. Physical spaces: prisons and refuges- having a "transgender" section within male prisons, rather than unisex, and refuges set up spefically for transgender people (remembering that women's refuges were a grassroots movement and many women would not be able to be in a refuge with a P-haver)
3. Sport: transpeople to compete in their own category, if they do not want to compete against their natal sex, where sex-segregation exists i.e. as has happened with disabled sports. Particularly important if women and girls are to continue to compete on a level playing field.
4. Statistics: serious concerns from transpeople about their safety and from women about the fact that some sexual crimes being recorded as "women's crimes" (e.g. 6 rapes, majority or all probably committed by transpeople last year): recording transcrimes, alongside female and male, both for victim and perpetrator
5. AW Shortlists, percentage of Board, etc - to have similar schemes for transpeople where applicable

I've probably left something out that is glaringly obvious but whizzing off to meet a friend so going to post before I do

I don’t think there is widespread desire to ‘go unisex’ and that, in the main, people want some sex segregated provision.

I think the vast majority view sex as binary and will not ever buy in to ideas around people with penises being women or females.

I think the majority will want trans people to be able to live life free from discrimination and will support the provision of unisex provision to compliment single sex provision.

I do think men’s prisons should have a unit for male transpeople. I am very strongly against any male being housed in a female prison, so that would be the solution. Then the prisoners would be safe from violence due on their GNC status, as everyone there would be trans.
I would be happy with a third space in loos too, but I can’t see that happening in most places. Ideally we would have clearer laws in sex segregation. Women’s loos should absolutely remain female sex only.
Sports, as you suggest op, either compete with your own sex, or in a separate trans category. That would quickly end all these male people who are hopeless against their own sex but can beat women .
All crime stats should record sex and any name changes.

These would all be fine except for the cost and administrative burden of setting up a range of new services / spaces for what should be a very small population, even with the wider umbrella being used. Plus if the issue is validation then trans / unisex / open categories / spaces won't be welcomed or used.

OP I think a lot of your suggestions sound incredibly sensible and practical!

I do wonder how much of the money and energy currently being used on all this campaigning (demanding access to women's spaces, lawsuits, harassment of gender critical people, etc) wouldn't be better spent on creating new services and support specifically for trans people. There seems to be at least a bit of money involved in trans activism, but the energy focuses on getting rid of sex-based protections for existing facilities instead of creating something bespoke for trans people.

Ihuntmonsters hit the nail on the head when it comes to the validation issue. I think this is central to the whole conflict in this issue.

Keep sex segregation.

I’d welcome third spaces to be used for anyone with additional needs - family or father/daughter or mother/son changing spaces at the pool for example would be great. Better facilities for families or anyone who needs a separate space (adults with caters etc) would be great all round.

However, third spaces are not what’s being pressed for here - the aim is to appropriate women’s spaces and places. Nothing else will do. You’re looking at it from a practical point of view, which is admirable, but it’s not how the activists look at it.