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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Stephanie Davies-Arai. Transgender Trend

95 replies

therealposieparker · 24/05/2018 12:54

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crispbuttyfan · 24/05/2018 17:20

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CharlieParley · 24/05/2018 17:27

I am afraid not, Baroquehavoc.

I read a paper just yesterday saying that less than 15% of trans youths put on puberty blockers and/or cross sex hormones received fertility preservation counselling and less than 5% took up an offer of preserving eggs/sperm in case they ever want to have kids. (The reasons for this incredibly low uptake varied but at least in part it must have a lot to do with the lack of maturity in most youngsters which simply doesn't allow them to understand the far reaching consequences)

And that's not even counting the kids who are medically transitioning so early they never become fertile in the first place...

busyboysmum · 24/05/2018 17:34

Agree. I was really disturbed by the ‘breast binding’ info. It listed all the ways it was physically damaging - and the damage can be pretty severe - but said that reports of feeling more positive as a result outweighed the likely physical harm. Because the girls felt their bodies were being brought more in line with how they felt they should truly be. But anorexics and bulimics report feelings of happiness and achievement when they’ve hit low weights etc. Bulimics feel calm and happy after purging etc. But we wouldn’t use those feelings to justify not treating eating disorders, or facilitating them. I honestly don’t see the difference.

R0wantrees · 24/05/2018 17:34

Damnthatonestakentryanother2 & crispbuttyfan

Have you watched the discussion? I'm genuinely curious.

Baroquehavoc · 24/05/2018 17:35

I'm sure in the strange logic that is TRA, it is about validation. I still don't understand how having a group of 15/16/17 olds with prepubescent bodies and brain development validate anybody.

UpstartCrow · 24/05/2018 17:46

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busyboysmum · 24/05/2018 17:59

Yes and they have no sexual feelings either. So will never enjoy a normal sex life.

Starkstaring · 24/05/2018 18:42

Damn and Crisp. Believe me when I say I have done a lot of research on this topic.

The evidence base for the outcomes of cross sex hormones and surgery is weak, particularly for FtM. No one knows the long term outcome of puberty blockers because the treatment hasn't been around very long.

I can't access it now to post but I will later - the NHS service specification consultation document says the same thing.

SeahorsesAREhorses · 24/05/2018 18:57

So, men who have low testosterone levels in US are now suing due to side effects. How will cross sex hormones affect girls in the future?

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 24/05/2018 18:57

Damnthatones, for well over a decade my work involved a constant awareness and understanding of medical ethics. One principle is that you only endanger a child's fertility if the situation is life and death. Cancer treatment, for example. The laissez-faire attitude of so many transactivist groups towards the medicalization of gender questioning kids is a genuine cause for concern.

There are fashions in medicine just as in other fields, and some of these fashions have caused significant harm. The most obvious is probably eugenics, but there have been a number of others. The current trans vogue fulfills the criteria for medical fashion. It arose very quickly, is unsupported by respectable research and yet has achieved almost universal acceptance. Voices urging caution are ignored or treated with contempt. When the bubble finally bursts a medical fashion usually ends as fast as it began.

In a decade or so the court hearings, the class actions are likely to start, cases from people whose healthy bodies have been damaged, who were sterilised as children. When that time comes, many of those now promoting trans ideology will claim that they always had their doubts.

Starkstaring · 24/05/2018 19:08

Lobotomy, anyone? I hear it is most effective for treating depression, all the experts say so. Or at least they did.

therealposieparker · 24/05/2018 20:41

I'm really excited to learn that so much secret work is being done to ensure all these drugs we give to kids are perfectly safe...

Can you share it?

OP posts:
Baroquehavoc · 24/05/2018 22:06

You might be waiting a while, posie

thebewilderness · 24/05/2018 22:22

Let’s not mention (how many?) people with zero experience of being female claiming to be female then...

That would violate the 8th rule.

I think that Lupron will be this generation of children's thalidomide.

There is a website of people who have suffered from the effects of puberty blockers. www.lupronvictimshub.com/

For most of us I think the concerns for children's welfare expressed by these women are every bit as important as the opinions of those who make a profit from experimenting on children.
Your dismissal of their concerns for these children is creepy.

ToeToToe · 24/05/2018 22:32

for well over a decade my work involved a constant awareness and understanding of medical ethics. One principle is that you only endanger a child's fertility if the situation is life and death. Cancer treatment, for example. The laissez-faire attitude of so many transactivist groups towards the medicalization of gender questioning kids is a genuine cause for concern.

This ^

I cannot, for the very life of me, understand how this is being allowed.

Thanks for posting, Posie.

LaSqrrl · 24/05/2018 22:37

Everything you said Prawn, everything.
It is also bigpharma's freebie medical trials into the bargain.

I have said for a while now, for YW looking for a career - go into law - there will be many lawsuits in the future.

LaSqrrl · 24/05/2018 22:38

I think that Lupron will be this generation of children's thalidomide.
Agreed, thebewilderness.

Offred · 24/05/2018 22:41

Ah at the deletion...

The post was a point regarding the ‘you can’t know unless you have lived experience and if you don’t have lived experience you aren’t allowed to speak’ thing.

The point being that by this logic if we must dismiss one group of people for apparently not having ‘lived experience’ then we must dismiss all groups who don’t have ‘lived experience’.

It ain’t what I believe... it’s the identifarian thinking, just pointing out it seems to be one rule for us and one for them...

FFS

archery2 · 24/05/2018 22:50

From the Tavistock Clinic's "evidence base" page:

"Although hormone blockers and cross-sex hormone treatment are recommended in young people with GD and widely used across the board, it should be noted that the research evidence for the effectiveness of any particular treatment offered is still limited."

archery2 · 24/05/2018 22:54

also from the Tavistock Clinic:

"Safety concerns remain regarding the impact of physical interventions. Although puberty suppression, cross-sex hormones and gender reassignment are generally considered safe treatments in the short term, the long-term effects regarding bone health and cardiovascular risks are still unknown"

and

"A Dutch research programme indicates that a treatment protocol including puberty suppression followed by cross-sex hormones and gender reassignment surgery, leads to improved psychological functioning in a selected group of transgender adolescents, who had persistent GD from childhood, lived in a supportive environment and had no serious co-morbidities."

BeUpStanding · 24/05/2018 23:32

Great video, thanks Posie.

It's terrifying and utterly bewildering how puberty blockers are being given to children. I still can't get my head around it at all.

WhatTheWaterShowedMe · 24/05/2018 23:51

I thought that video was extremely compassionate in that what it urged was caution- it didn’t scaremonger, Stephanie spoke common sense, she emphasised the lack of evidence for this sort of medical intervention and highlighted that there needs to be more research done. Kids should not be experimental test subjects.

Damnthatonestakentryanother2 · 25/05/2018 02:52

lightthedarkness
Good to hear from someone with so much experience in child psychology / development.
Yes. A whole four-day course in "communicating with children". Of course that trumps all those people with years of study at medical college, CPD, and clinical experience, who describe her methods as "unethical".

Sarahconnor1 · 25/05/2018 07:08

Offred I can't believe that was deleted it was a perfectly valid point.

Offred · 25/05/2018 07:12

It’s quite funny really that when I say what they say I get deleted....

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