Male entitlement at a bar

[villandrychat]

I've been mulling over this event since it happened on Friday and wondered what other people thought.
I was out for after work drinks with some girlfriends on Friday, ranging in age from mid 40s to mid 50s. We were having a great time, when some random bloke came over and started trying to chat us up. He sat next to me and draped his arm round me, which I pointedly removed. He proceeded to hog the conversation, and started off telling us an "amusing" story (his definition of it). He was blocking my way out and I was needing the loo. I asked to get past him, and he said just listen to the end of this, it's good (so good I can't even remember what it was ). I was desperate (middle-aged bladder!) and asked him a further two times, and he said, no, you just sit here until I've finished telling you this. At this point I lost it, and said I'd already asked him three times, so if he didn't get the fuck out of my way right now, I was going to get security to kick him out. He very huffily moved, and I squeezed past him. I was so angry that he thought he could just override my requests like that, his sheer entitlement made me furious. And the fact that people seem to put up with men like him. I feel like I've overreacted, but part of me felt like punching him! It made me realise why I hate bars - I put up with so much shit like this as a teen/20s, and I'm now a menopausal angry woman who won't take shit from anyone!

[LighthouseSouth]

sounds familiar

it's usually easier to say "fuck off" first, then you haven't wasted a bunch of time.

I always remember waiting for some friends in a bar. A man approached me and said "hi, you're very...."

and I just said, with a glacial and loud voice "wwwwwwwwwwhat?"

and he looked alarmed and said "...er, well spoken. very well spoken!" and ran away.

I almost said "good save" when I passed him later on the way to the bar.

[poopsqueak]

Well first of all he touched you without you wanting him to. Then he dominated your conversation without you wanting him to. Then he ignored your request for him to move. Then he said no to your request to move. So given that he has completely ignored you explicit and implicit desires without swearing, then yes i think you were right to tell him to fuck off.

[LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett]

I remember when I was younger, if I was meeting a female friend in a bar we always met outside, at the bus stop, or in another spot. We never, EVER met inside the bar.

I once went down to a hotel bar for a quiet drink while DH was putting DS to bed. Took a book (an actual physical book) to deter randoms, then a bloke came over to me twitched my book out of my hands and started to mansplain the concept of Kindles to me.

FFS it's relentless.

I think you were very restrained OP.

[HerFemaleness]

That reminds me @LaSqrrl, back in my uni days of the guy who told me he shoots blanks and his wife doesn't mind if he plays around. Astonishingly none of us took him up on his implied offer of unprotected sex, or even sex at all.

[DevilsDoorbell]

Shock horror, women swear!

Seriously, I don’t think you were rude or over reacted. I think you handled it very well.

He was rude and deserved more quite frankly. About time we got angry at people like this.

[Waddlelikeapenguin]

He was basically holding you captive against your will, swearing is the least he deserved.
I can never get my head around a man thinking that they should seduce a wonan by showing they have no regard for the woman's physical boundaries or consent.

[deydododatdodontdeydo]

Not an over-reaction, he didn't give you much other option, having physically blocked you.
What a twat.

[villandrychat]

Lonnyvonny that's outrageous!

[villandrychat]

As a librarian and avid reader I'd be murderous towards anyone who separated me from my book!

[Aeroflotgirl]

No you were fine, you had every right to talk to him like that including the swearing, after he ignored your polite requests to move. Why are women condition to be meek and polite. What an idiot!

[UpstartCrow]

a bloke came over to me twitched my book out of my hands and started to mansplain the concept of Kindles to me

I've heard of this, and men shutting a laptop to interrupt a woman.
Can you imagine trying that on? Men sit and read the paper in public and no one would grab it off them to demand their attention!

[Juells]

@Vicky1990

I'm afraid you get men and women like this every where, I have found so called hen parties the worst.
I have had to move tables a number of times when eating out due to the moronic screaming and shouting by some of these women ruining a meal.

Completely different thing. A bunch of women being loud. Not a woman coming to annoy you and insist on talking at you and preventing you from leaving.

[SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius]

”I once went down to a hotel bar for a quiet drink while DH was putting DS to bed. Took a book (an actual physical book) to deter randoms, then a bloke came over to me twitched my book out of my hands and started to mansplain the concept of Kindles to me.”



How did you restrain yourself from whipping the book back out of his hands and twatting him with it, LonnyVonny?

[MinaPaws]

You didn't overreact. Men like that need women like you to show them how their behaviour is really going down. The more women gently try to stop hurting the whopping egos of entitled men, the more those men barge in and take over every situation. It bores the arse off me. Good for you.

[MinaPaws]

I'm in my early 40s and have only just realised how many hours of my life have been spent politely listening to very boring and very unfunny stories by men. Know that I'm aware of it, its unrelenting.

God yes. It's bad enough having to put up with this from elderly male relatives who I choose not to shut up because I can't be arsed with the sulks that would ensue. But their monologues and mansplains take up a vast chunk of precious free time, so allowing randoms in pubs to take up even more time is just not possible.

I've noticed DS1 does this. How do you stop them from thinking the sound of their own voice if the most fascinating music on the planet? I genuoinely don't want to damage his fragile teenage ego. But I can't let him loose on the world like this. Any ideas how to discourage it?

[LighthouseSouth]

Mina, in case it helps

I'm passionate about books, films, story structure - can bang on endlessly about the use of a stage direction etc.

what I do is ask the listener if it's okay for me to talk about x - even to my family - and say "shut me up if it gets too much".

in terms of wasted time, OMD, my current contract is ending soon and there's one man who has driven me mad. He repeats the same point at length in meetings, interrupts any women he sees talking anywhere, thinks his opinion is worth volumes of Shakespeare even if it's just "we need some new exhibition banners". I feel like I have wasted half my working day on him for months now. I've tried "well I must let you get on as you're so busy" but he says "no, I'm all right for time".

I think they do it on purpose - more so in a work place because you can't tell them to fuck off.

[deydododatdodontdeydo]

I've noticed DS1 does this. How do you stop them from thinking the sound of their own voice if the most fascinating music on the planet? I genuoinely don't want to damage his fragile teenage ego. But I can't let him loose on the world like this. Any ideas how to discourage it?

DD does this. I'm genuinely at a loss. She talks almost non-stop the whole time she's awake. She's also not interested in the thoughts of others, just her own opinions.
DS is quiet and thoughtful, and respectful of others. I hope he doesn't change when he's older.
We've brought them up the same!

[Juells]

@MinaPaws

I've noticed DS1 does this. How do you stop them from thinking the sound of their own voice if the most fascinating music on the planet? I genuoinely don't want to damage his fragile teenage ego. But I can't let him loose on the world like this.

Oh dear, I'm afraid I laughed out loud at this, imagining your face as he holds forth.

[nolongerblue]

Deydo, I had a flatmate like this once. She just talked nonstop. She never seemed to notice if you didn't respond to her. Once, cos she wouldn't shut up, I just started to get ready for bed, expecting her to get the hint. But no, she followed me into the bathroom whilst I cleaned my teeth. Followed me into my bedroom whilst I got changed, talking all the while non stop. ANd, she continued talking at me once I got into bed!!!!! SHe just wouldn't shut up.

[deydododatdodontdeydo]

nolonger, my DD would definitely do that!

[MinaPaws]

Lighthouse out of interest - has anyone ever said to you: 'Shut up now. It got too much'? I just wonder if by syaing that, you are warning people that you go on, but that doesn't mean they have the guts to interrupt you. I do sometimes tell DS he;s talking at me not with me, but he goes so silent and sad afterwards that I feel guilty. Minefield.

[LaSqrrl]

That reminds me @LaSqrrl, back in my uni days of the guy who told me he shoots blanks and his wife doesn't mind if he plays around. Astonishingly none of us took him up on his implied offer of unprotected sex, or even sex at all.

Tempting offer, why not?!

Isn't the "wife doesn't understand me / doesn't mind" the No.1 in the Scumbag Handbook? I dunno, I burned the only copy I got my hands on.

[Juells]

Ugh, my mother - whom I loved dearly - got like this when she was older. She came to live with me and almost drove me crazy. I like silence, I'd be working away on my computer and she'd talk and talk and talk. I built a wall across the kitchen to make my work area separate, she used to still come in and talk at me. I then put a screen around where I sat, she'd pull it aside and talk at me. She walked with a stick, so I put things all over the floor, she said "This is ridiculous, it's like an obstacle course". :( Nothing got through to her, not asking, not telling, not physically trying to keep her out. What I resent about people like that is their insistence that their stream of consciousness is being forced into your brain, leaving no room for your own thoughts. It's obsessive, compulsive.

[LighthouseSouth]

@MinaPaws - no but I notice their micro expressions and if I get a hint of them glazing over, I stop.

also I tend to bang on about it to other enthusiasts. I would never start on at someone who wasn't already into that stuff.

re fragile teenage ego, I do think you need to tell teens if they are talking too much, or at you. Better it comes from a loved one than a fellow teen losing their rag with them while they're out? Or is it better coming from peers...?

[AmazingPostVoices]

Did none of your friends back you up OP? I’m a bit surprised about that.