I never thought I’d see the day I agreed with something David Davies has said 🙁

[missbonita]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5748821/Children-young-4-told-head-teacher-tell-pupils-misgender-classmates.html

I never thought I’d see the day I was in agreement with an article in the daily mail or anything misogynist Davies said. Strange times.

Yes I think I've entered an alternative universe.

Seriously? My son is behind in his education and has only just learned he is a boy even then he doesn't get that right half the time he 8s 5

I have just spent a morning at the shops in the boys dept buying my eight year old daughter brightly coloured shorts and t shirts with sharks on them (she is going through a shark phase)

She plays football, loves climbing trees, kicks about in jeans, t shirts and trainers, has no interest in dresses, babies, makeup or any performance of ‘femininity’

There are lots of ways to be a girl and she has many varied female toke models in her life - from high achieving blonde high heeled Aunty to short haired, jeans wearing equally high achieving great Aunty.

This primary school is imposing an ideology on small children. It is encouraging parents to make life changing decisions for children who are still exploring and should be free to do this without adults imposing all this crap on them.

It’s like an unofficial religious orthodoxy.

You know this is David Davies (who is supportive of the attempts to discuss reforms to the GRA) and not the minister for Brexit David Davis?

fucking hell. My children would NOT be going to that school.

this bloody ideology is pervasive and poisonous.

DS spent the morning dolling himself up with my make-up (mascara, a nice pink lipstick beard, plus a lovely scouse brow since you ask). I've spent the afternoon alternately thinking 'he was just having a bit of fun' (which is true), and wondering if I should have shut it down or encouraged it. You just worry about some nutcase like that head teacher getting their hands on your child and misconstruing everything.

I am woman. When I was 4 I cut off all my hair, I insisted on weeing standing up and use to fantastise about being a farmer and driving a tractor. I am so glad I had the chance to grow up to be me. I am so sad about this

Should peak trans a few more people. I also was desperate to be a boy at primary school (because I thought boys got to do better things, though I think my dad's attitude to girls/women didn't help) but I grew out of it into being a woman who mostly rejects femininity, but I am another person who thinks what the hell would have happened to me if it was now.

Loling at the comments. I don't think there's a single one in favour of this headmaster, and all the upvotes are in support of the commenters.

There is a lovely boy in my child’s primary class (year 6) who likes wearing a long pink wig, plays with Barbies and nail polish and has done since toddlers. He is confident that he is a boy. Mum is happy to have a ‘pink and fluffy’ house. He plays more with girls because his interests have more common interests with them (though they are now moving on to other things instead of Barbies). No one has suggested he is trans and he himself has no doubts. Why should he? That would just be indulging stereotypes.

He sounds fab Moss

He's not steering away from the binary model. He's reinforcing it every day.

Its concerning to me that David Davies, Jacob Rees Mogg and Norman Tebbit have seemed so far to be the main voices speaking out on this subject.
With the power balance within the Conservative party, Westminster and also Brexit/Remain being so marginal, they and the Daily Mail etc may be able to gain significant political capital by being seen by some as the voices of 'rationality or common sense'.
blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/04/jacob-rees-mogg-radical-feminist/
blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/05/why-are-some-mps-trying-to-shut-down-the-transgender-debate/

R0wantrees

A recent thread featured multiple Mumsnetters announcing they were switching from the Guardian to the Spectator, at least in part due to the GC debate.

Isn't the problem more that, though the TRAs are the worst, the Left in general has lost its way over this to such an extent that people are turning to JRM, Tebbit etc over this issue at least?

Mike Stuchbery was tweeting about that March for Free Speech a few weeks back and was saying what a big mistake it was for the Left to cede the Free Speech debate to the Right. He's not wrong.

I wonder how many kids might pretend and say they're trans just so that they can have a "special assembly" that's all about them?
Just a thought.

I worry that as we see on the Jordan Peterson thread, when people agree with someone on some things, they seem to apply a much lower level of critical thinking to what ever other guff that person comes out with.

If the likes of Jacob Rees Mogg are allowed to control the narrative around reasserting sanity over sex, not gender I worry about what else will come in through that door. It will probably be no good for transsexual people, or women.

Arbury holds assemblies to celebrate a child's 'transition' from a boy to a girl or vice versa
How often does it happen???

For children at primary level, the more we can do to non-stereotype them the better. We steer away from the binary model.
Isn't encouraging them to change gender the opposite of this?

The article was a bit meh I thought, but the stuff about mixed sex forms on school trips, and the YHA not segregating by sex will hopefully peak trans a few folk.

sn't encouraging them to change gender the opposite of this?

I suspect they are referring to the binary model of sex, not gender.

As reallybadidea said, people maybe confusing David Davies with David Davis Brexit minister

How would this possibly help kids. Labelling and stereotyping them based on (...well, what, exactly?) while they are still in primary school.. then forcing all the other primary age kids to validate those gender stereotypes and ignore their own observations of fact, or they get into trouble. Encouraging the kids’ parents to change the ‘trans’ kids’ names by deed poll??
Does the Prevent strategy in schools cover this type of dogmatic politicking in schools?

Thoughts: there is no such thing as biological gender. Sex is biological, gender is a social construct.
I find it very concerning indeed when I agree, even a little tiny bit, with anything published in the daily fail, but I’m glad they have got hold of this, because judging by a cursory glance through the comments, the majority of their readers have no truck with it whatsoever.

If the likes of Jacob Rees Mogg are allowed to control the narrative around reasserting sanity over sex, not gender I worry about what else will come in through that door. It will probably be no good for transsexual people, or women.

Or the LGB. I agree. Anyone thinking post-Brexit Britain won't be vulnerable to some very unpleasant political backlash needs to think again. Anything done in the name of the left will be punished more than anything done in the name of the right.

I worry that as we see on the Jordan Peterson thread, when people agree with someone on some things, they seem to apply a much lower level of critical thinking to what ever other guff that person comes out with.

YY I note that JP says 50% of his followers are women. It seems to me that many women are taken in by his stuff as being pro-women - which it's not. He seems to appeal to those who are looking for a "good man". And to challenge those women then brings with it all that displaced anger that can't be taken to men.

I imagine his rhetoric appeals to those women who still think that male guardianship works. He says male violence is wrong but the solutions he proposes still rely on subjugated women enabling male sexual entitlement.

There are no solutions that he proposes that tackle male violence (other than he magically expects that men will grow up and mature out of it). I see his dominance and his games now and he's not offering anything new nor progressive nor workable.

Don't want to derail this thread re JP - I agree that critical thinking can be lacking and I think I know why now - because many women are still hoping/believing that good men exist - they do but seemingly not in the numbers necessary to make monogamy workable as a solution to anything, other than enslaving women.

The problem I see clearly in this reporting is conflating sex and gender. Using the wrong sex loos in the same sentence as the introduction of a gender-neutral uniform.