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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Reading matter for pre peaker.

20 replies

Ledkr · 18/04/2018 21:01

A colleague was asking about the trans issue and asked me to send her some reasing about it all.
She has been "told" that it's nonsense that men can just self ID and use women's services/places.
Can anyone recommend anything please?

OP posts:
Badgerthebodger · 18/04/2018 21:02

What about any of Helen Saxby’s blogs?

notthenewsinbriefs.wordpress.com

UpstartCrow · 18/04/2018 21:03

A colleague? As its work, dont get involved, let her do her own research.

MaisyPops · 18/04/2018 21:08

I'd let her do her own exploring.

There's no one way to develop views (I still feel a bit iffy about the phrase 'peak trans' I'm gender critical, but think calls to deliberately misgender someone are unkind so am TERFS according to some but too libral for others)
Allow her to do her own research and arrive at her own conclusions.

Original poster
Ledkr · 18/04/2018 21:38

Yes maisy I did wonder about that.
I read Twitter a lot and think that the nastiness on both sides detracts from the main issues. I don't want to be part of that but I do want to retain women's right to safe spaces.
It's a shame it's all got like this.

OP posts:
OvaHere · 18/04/2018 21:44

There was a thread here a while back with a 'newbie' being very patiently walked through all the implications of self ID and seeing it all dawn on her with every subsequent post she made.

I can't remember the title but if someone else has it book marked that would be a good starting point.

MaisyPops · 18/04/2018 22:08

Ledkr
That's why you need to allow her to do her own research.

It's a nightmare at times, especily when basic definitions and language are being rewritten. But she'll find her own way, e.g. I came to the conclusion that I have an issue with the 'i put a dress on, say I'm a woman and now you lesbians who won't have sex with me are transphobes' crew, but have no issue with transwoman who has gone through the full transition process and just wants to get on with her life free from discrimination. I think the first group are too loud and too preoccupied with trying to silence women. But the 2nd group, they've probably had enough shit feeling their brain and body doesn't match, gone through a lot and should be left alone without people cockily misgendering them to point prove.

thebewilderness · 18/04/2018 22:18

I suggest giving her the actual text of the GRA and the 2010 EA then the proposed amendment for Self ID.
A link to fair play for women will help her make sense of them but without the poorly written law to look at it is hard to follow the discussion.

SupermatchGame · 18/04/2018 22:26

MaisyPops Your 2 groups explanation is exactly how I see it. Exactly. It's reassuring to see others with similar views.

op - youtube might also be useful to point towards, some good vids with GC content including need for more gnc role models and this discussion with Julie Bindel.

SupermatchGame · 18/04/2018 22:58

Just thought about this a bit more. I understand what others mean re. if it's work, better not to get involved. Definitely don't go recommending jb videos to colleagues. Sorry. Should have thought that through.

Winewinewinegin · 18/04/2018 23:06

Why on earth would you not recommend jb videos to a colleague at work?

Winewinewinegin · 18/04/2018 23:06

Assuming jb refers to the Julie bindel link above

Winewinewinegin · 18/04/2018 23:07

Janice turner stuff in the Times is another good intro, the most recent one was good.

SupermatchGame · 18/04/2018 23:15

As the other (more experienced) posters have subtly implied, it could get you into difficulties. You don't know why a colleague would be asking or if you could fully trust them, or who else might find out. jb view not seen as pc in many workplaces.

CunningOperative · 18/04/2018 23:44

Sages factsheet

HopScotchy · 18/04/2018 23:49

Peaking needs to focus on the trans side. Until they've seen that they will see women's rights as overreacting. This is a good start edinburghath.tumblr.com/post/163521055802/trans-health-manifesto

UpstartCrow · 19/04/2018 01:09

Focus on protecting women's rights - and yourself. Do not discuss trans rights activists with colleagues, in or out of work.

DarthArts · 19/04/2018 02:32

Tbh everyone I've spoken to understood.

Every single one.

It's not transphobic to talk about the potential impact of self id.

Everyone needs to talk about this.

The fear of speaking out is exactly what activists want.

thebewilderness · 19/04/2018 02:36

I suppose you could simply print out and give her a copy of the trans health manifesto. It leaves no room for doubt.
fairplayforwomen.com/transgender-organisation-demands/

hipsterumlaut · 19/04/2018 04:06

This walked me through all the issues when I was new to everything and I think it is very good -

thenewbacklash.blogspot.co.uk/

Duddlepluck · 19/04/2018 13:26

Thanks for that hipsterumlaut - added to my folder of useful resoiurces

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