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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

Long hair for girls

48 replies

Polynerd · 13/04/2018 23:12

Is anyone else fed up with the crushing orthodoxy that little girls 'must' have long hair? My youngest started school with a sensible bob, but this combined with her trousers and 'boys' shoes (ie warm and sturdy shoes) caused many of the other children to insist repeatedly that she was a boy. Now she won't let me cut her hair at all so in mid-Y1 it is halfway down her back, looking bloody awful and causing me a lot of work every morning.
Meanwhile my eldest, who is mid-teens, has very short hair with a quiff and a shave but has been talking about growing it out. The other day she told one of my friends that I had told her not to grow it long because it was a symbol of the patriarchy. This is true but the friend she said it to has a daughter with mega-long hair and I think she was offended.
Am I overreacting to see my girls' hair as a political symbol?

OP posts:

Branleuse · 14/04/2018 10:24

If she wants long hair to fit in at school, then you should let her. Shes forced to go to school and be with these people for 30 hours a week, and part of this is conforming to stuff. Let her fight the patriarchy when shes older if she wants, or if and when SHE decides to.

From a woman whos spare-rib-reading mother decided to strongly discourage me from shaving my legs or armpits as a teen and was mercilessly bullied.

Original poster

Polynerd · 14/04/2018 10:45

I mean I do let her have long hair but I believe this is the age at which it all starts. She is now building a self image of herself as someone who has to perform femininity in order to be accepted by society. Having said that, this is an age at which the differences between boys and girls en masse (obvs there are many exceptions) are very striking. Most of the girls are engaged permanently in highly complex social rituals, while most of the boys run around screaming.

OP posts:

Branleuse · 14/04/2018 11:06

The boys are not just running around screaming. They are also being taught how to perform masculinity and repress femininity

Fifi5000 · 14/04/2018 11:24

Yes that’s true. I notice all my children taking very careful note of what the other children of their sex are doing. Interestingly, it seems that other children have a stronger influence than adults.

MargeH · 14/04/2018 11:29

My daughter had a curly bob when she started school and ended up with nits. Growing it long allowed it to be plaited or in a ponytail which dramatically reduced the problem

Original poster

Polynerd · 14/04/2018 11:35

@Branleuse very true.

OP posts:

purpleanorak · 14/04/2018 11:36

Happy to have brutal, honest responses to this (because I don’t quite understand it myself) but why is it that I admire women who don’t take an orthodox approach to hairstyles but don’t really like certain hairstyles on men? I have quite a strong dislike of hair longer than chin length on men, to the extent that I don’t fancy most otherwise attractive men with longer hair.

It must be to do with society and expectations because historically men have had longer hair. I wonder if it is partly about connotations of social status because today there are very few high profile successful men with long hair. But I just find it a bit odd that in other respects I hate gender norms but am strangely conservative in my feelings about male hairstyles!

On the other hand, I love short hair on women. It doesn’t suit me but if I had the figure and face for it I would definitely have a more androgynous style. In another life I would love to be a tall, skinny, short haired woman with a wardrobe full of trouser suits!

NeverUseThisName · 14/04/2018 11:52

Both my sons had long hair and a love of pink (and other bright colours) bullied out of them in junior school. They just got fed up of the social pressure.

The younger in particular had an additional challenge to contend with. Instead of just being teased, he was also told by his peers that he must be trans.

The elder in his teens had the confidence to experiment with long hair again. This time it attracted nothing but positive attention. So much so that he eventually got fed up and cut it off again.

I think it is in people's nature to want to identify and understand others. The basic understanding, I suppose, is male/female, and hair is a major cultural cue.

LassWiADelicateAir · 14/04/2018 12:01

I really like long hair on young men. All my teenage crushes , real life and fantasy, had long hair. Robert Plant and Ian Gillan for example had beautiful hair.

Branleuse · 14/04/2018 12:17

@purpleanorak - Maybe you just like short hair in general?

YetAnotherSpartacus · 14/04/2018 12:24

Long hair is much easier assuming it isn't thick and/or curly. In my case, it means I can wash and wear or pop in a ponytail and hardly ever have to endure the boredom and cost of the salon.

AstraiaLiberty · 14/04/2018 13:38

I can see both sides. I have long hair now and it's no bother. Takes five minutes to comb and put in a (fairly indestructible) bun and I have a trim a few times a year.

However, when I was a little girl with long hair that I wasn't allowed to cut, I hated having to sit every day for painful brushing and tight plaiting and lots of fussing over how it looked. I was so pleased when I was finally allowed to have a bob at age 10-ish.

It's hair. I don't see why children shouldn't be allowed to decide what length to have it themselves - both boys and girls.

Branleuse · 14/04/2018 13:50

my 10 year old daughter wants a mohawk. Im reluctant to let her have one, although id probably be less reluctant if it was my son.

Im trying to work out if its because its because its unfeminine or whether its too grown up a style.

KittTheCar · 14/04/2018 13:52

Whether long / short is easier or not depends on hair type & style I think, there isn't a "right answer".

For me the thing about young girls being expected to stand / sit still for sometimes a long time, and have often painful hair things done to them, is awful. That is a massive preparation for living in a patriarchal society, that there will be boredom and pain involved in order to comply with standards of femininity / decorativeness, and this is normal.

Ditto when very young girls are put in clothes that restrict their movement (I saw this a lot with crawling + dresses) or are told not to do xyz as they will mess their clothes up.Which I have seen less, but have seen.

SpartacusTheCat · 14/04/2018 13:55

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

KittTheCar · 14/04/2018 13:55

I had all mine cut off recently and it's great, I feel much more like "me" it's hard to explain. I did have hair that was highly "patriarchy approved" and it was long, people were a bit shocked both times I've gone for the chop! Once when I was young (80s) and again like I say recently.

It's fashion for teen girls in particular to have this extreme high maintenance look at the moment, and has been for a while, hopefully the tide will turn soon.

SpartacusTheCat · 14/04/2018 14:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

KittTheCar · 14/04/2018 14:08

Fashions do change and it's been a while so hopefully time for a change!

I'd love to see a return to the days when it was a free for all - male / female / makeup / clothes -

I think that one positive out of the trans movement is that it might free this up - if young people have a label to use to "excuse" their lack of gender conformity they might be more willing to go for it. Breast binding / hormones etc really not so hot, but many kids who ID as trans or gender vairant it's a tribal thing with a different fashion sense from what i can see and that seems fine to me (fact that gender is bollocks aside).

One issue with this - I have seen a transwoman write that if women want to support then they need to adopt the trappings of femininity to the max as this makes it easier for TW to pass. If the fashion is for women to have short hair and wear unisex type clothes and little makeup, it makes it much harder for them. Will there be pushback from some quarters of the trans community, if other quarters start destabilising the current massive divide between things coded male & female (ie masculine and feminine)?

Fifthtimelucky · 14/04/2018 14:58

My girls had very long hair when they were younger and in many ways I found it easier to manage than medium length hair (except for one awful year when one of them kept getting head lice). It usuallly went in a long plait which kept it out of the way and knot free. In no way did it interfere with their ability to hang upside down on monkey bars, climb trees or do any other physical activity.

I don't think any of this is new though. My primary aged sisters and I were often mistaken for boys in the 60s because we had short hair.

GraceMarks · 14/04/2018 18:18

I don't believe that short hair is necessarily higher maintenance. I have very thick, frizzy hair which becomes a sort of tangled thicket if left to grow, so I have it in a short crop. Yes, I have to get it cut every 5 weeks, but in terms of daily maintenance, it's just a quick brush before I leave the house.

I do sometimes get mistaken for a man, especially as I don't dress in a feminine way or wear make up, and I have quite a low voice. It bothers me less and less as I get older, as to an extent I'm shielded from some of the unwanted attention that comes with just being a woman.

2rebecca · 14/04/2018 19:53

I find short hair is more hassle than longer, probably largely due to vanity as I feel it needs styled more to look good and unless you have beautiful features and cheekbones is more exposing. Mid length hair is a nuisance as bunches for running and cycling look strange in your 50s and I'm starting to feel too old for pony tail length hair

NiceHotBath · 14/04/2018 21:08

I found dd2 wanted long hair once the peer pressure kicked in (start of Y2), though she looks better with a bob. She was the only girl in Y1 with shorter than shoulder length hair. So she has long hair now.

Dd1 is caught in the ballet bun bind - she’d like it shorter but she would have major issues with shows, exams, auditions etc. So it is as short as it can go and still go in all types of bun (low and high) and Heidi plaits. There isn’t a girl with short hair in her year, either, which is what makes me think this is very much socially imposed rather than individual preferences all happening to be in favour of long hair.

hipsterfun · 15/04/2018 00:36

Is anyone else fed up with the crushing orthodoxy that little girls 'must' have long hair?

Well no, but I’m not aware of this crushing orthodoxy, nor have I seen much evidence of the outcome where we are.

Agree with this.

OP, have you tried a Tangle Teezer? Combined with loosely plaiting at bed time so it’s easy to brush and re-plait/put in a ponytail in the morning, I don’t have any bother with DD’s long, thick hair. Three-minute job, twice a day.

(Forgive me if you’ve tried everything already. I’m the last person on earth to be giving out hair and beauty tips - this is pretty much all I’ve got )

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