Trans only spaces

[JacintaJones]

Apparently trans people are such a significant minority that we can change the way women are referred to in common parlance on their account.

Aren't they therefore significant enough to warrant the inclusion of 'trans only' spaces?
Specifically for pre op trans people.

Why isn't this sermingly a consideration?
It would certainly remedy a lot of this mess we seem to be in at present.

A male space, a female space and a unisex space would be the obvious solution.

And for men who are genuinely transsexual and have gender dysphoria, I should imagine it would probably work. Especially if the unisex space was self contained.

But for the men who are aroused by being a woman, the whole point is to get into women spaces.

That's what they target everything woman. Women swim sessions, online midwifery forums, pregnancy chat rooms, make up tips websites, feminist book stores, talks by women, etc.

It's arousing to force women to accept them.

Yes, they should have their own space. That is not enough for them. They want to be us and want to be in our spaces. I have no idea how a person can say that their feelings are more important than those of a rape and abuse victim's desire to feel safe and comfortable, but I am not really surprised. As men, they will never have had any experience of the fear of male rape and violence. They claim to be so much more oppressed than us, but that is because they ignore all our oppression and pretend it's not there. We have cis-privilege apparently. I feel so enormously privileged that my sex has only been allowed to vote for the past 90 years, were allowed to be raped in marriage until 27 years ago and still earn so much less for doing so much more. I am sure the women around the globe who are mutilated and brutalised and denied an education because of their biology feel privileged too. Because that is nothing compared to the literal pain and violence you would feel if someone politely asked you not to use the ladies' changing room.

he Roz Kaveneys and Jane Faes of this world went to the extra effort to use them

I wonder what St India of Willougby would have to say about that.

She would say LET THAT PENETRATE

Although you will find, if you look, that 'trans only' groups and safe spaces have been considered perfectly acceptable when and only when trans people want them: for example support groups.

Which is fully understandable. Those issues can only fully be discussed by those with that lived experience and situation and privacy and feeling safe is paramount.

That privilege however is emphatically not allowed to be extended to biological women. Biological women may have no spaces of any kind that exclude transwomen. If you dig deeper the reason includes a lot of word salad with the word 'privilege' in it, which basically means 'you're female and deserve to be punished'.

There is no logic. There is no fairness. There is no equality or evenhandedness, care or understanding for anyone born female, you can shut up and do as you're told or stay out of women's spaces. This is about forcing female people to surrender.

Mouthtrousersafrocknowandthen

That made me laugh. Between Professional Man and your comment MN is amusing me to no end today.

OP wrote - "the inclusion of 'trans only' spaces? Specifically for pre op trans people. Why isn't this sermingly [sic] a consideration?"

The political ideology of transgenderism is about male entitlement, validation of male feelings, and violation of female boundaries. It's a male rights movement. It's not about the safety of people with sex dysmorphia or gender dysphoria (i.e. transsexual people) - if only it were.

If a transgender-identifying male person claims to be female, this person validates their belief by using female spaces, not by using spaces that are for the exclusive use of transgender-identifying males.

I think it is ironic that although transgenderism's supporters claim that "transwomen are women", it seems that many transwomen would not feel validated as women if they were expected to use spaces for transwomen, instead of obtaining access to the spaces of biologically female women.

Well put, vesuvia.

I am assuming Jacinta is new to these arguments. I think it's really helpful to go over them for the benefit of others who are also new to this board