Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Can you educate me please

38 replies

Theworldisfullofidiots · 01/03/2018 16:15

I'm really struggling to form an opinion on the trans issue that I can articulate.
On the one hand I'm really sympathetic to people with trans issues as it must be a difficult path to chose the tread.
On the other hand I have read some of the threads on here with shock. I just can't understand the sports issues, just how is it a level playing field (unintentional pun)? And surely trans issues are different to women's issues and need a separate space or something will be lost.
Please help me make sense of this and my thinking.

OP posts:
Stilettosandan0venglove · 01/03/2018 21:46

desperate to bring it up with friends, wondering how to pass on your new found knowledge without sounding utterly unhinged

This is me. I'm itching to talk about it but I don't know how to start. Got any good opening gambits?

thenightsky · 01/03/2018 21:53

You're going to lose hours to this and find yourself desperate to bring it up with friends, wondering how to pass on your new found knowledge without sounding utterly unhinged

Yep... this has been me over the past year. I fear the whole thing would have passed me by if not for MN.

SeaWitchly · 01/03/2018 23:39

You're going to lose hours to this and find yourself desperate to bring it up with friends, wondering how to pass on your new found knowledge without sounding utterly unhinged

Yep, me too.

Waddlelikeapenguin · 02/03/2018 01:32

You're going to lose hours to this and find yourself desperate to bring it up with friends, wondering how to pass on your new found knowledge without sounding utterly unhinged
Grin nailed it
So far my experience of passing on information has been positive, the consultation was a good conversation starter.

Iwasjustabouttosaythat · 02/03/2018 02:02

You're going to lose hours to this and find yourself desperate to bring it up with friends, wondering how to pass on your new found knowledge without sounding utterly unhinged

I was telling DP the other day about “google ‘women murdered in 2017’”. Upon expressing my rage and disbelief I was informed that I’m on the wrong side of things, coming across as intolerant etc. He went so far as to tell me that it’s all a bit Germaine Greer and new feminists don’t feel that way. I may have yelled “don’t try to fucking mainsplain feminism to me!!!!”

DP is very nice and smart and is now more aware of the issues at play here. Wink

thenightsky · 02/03/2018 09:51

this just popped up on my FB feed

It was posted by someone who I thought would be very pro-trans. Perhaps the message is slowly getting out.

TheGoldenBough · 03/03/2018 10:08

You're going to lose hours to this and find yourself desperate to bring it up with friends, wondering how to pass on your new found knowledge without sounding utterly unhinged

Yep. Unfortunately, it sounds so insane that whenever I have tried to explain it to anyone they look at me like I've bought into some ridiculously misguided radfem propaganda and misunderstood the whole thing.

It's so huge and nonsensical that it's really hard to know where to start.

The people I've brought it up with think I've made a mistake.

vaginafetishist · 03/03/2018 13:16

Especially when you try to explain about AGP.

loveyouradvice · 03/03/2018 13:51

Yup....losing hours to this too... and my DH ... continues to think I have got it wrong - "it's so illogical that it can't possibly be like that".... think he's about to peak trans.... but does piss me off that he thought I had got it wrong and didnt then find out why I was thinking this....

MsBeaujangles · 03/03/2018 14:01

In relation to talking to your daughter, the way I explained it to mine was:

It is totally unacceptable to exclude anyone from anything based on their gender. Gender relates to masculinity and femininity. Society has a tendency to label jobs, clothes, behaviours etc as masculine and feminine and then expect males to conform to the masculine ones and females the feminine ones. This is unnecessarily limiting for everyone and shouldn't happen. All people should be able to be as masculine and/or feminine as they wish. Transgender people can experience all sorts of issues because of their non conformity to society's expectations of male = masculine and female = feminine, and this isn't acceptable. We should promote tolerance and acceptance of gender non conformity.

Gender shouldn't be conflated with sex. Sex differences exist according to biology and, in some specific instances, people should be treated differently according to sex (e.g. medical screening, separate sporting competition, and sex segregated service and spaces for situations where women are vulnerable).

As this segregation is according to sex is not exclusionary and it does not discriminate against trans people. No one is excluded from their own sex category because of their gender identity. However, there is an overlap with issues with gender, because where people are gender non conforming, they can feel vulnerable because they don't present themselves like most people of the same sex. Here, again, we need to challenge and extend societies expectations around gender conformity.

There are also some people who deeply wish they were of the other sex or believe they are of the other sex. This is gender dysphoria and is a medical condition for which they should receive treatment and support

GaraMedouar · 03/03/2018 14:06

OP - I feel the same as you and mainly lurking at the mo, but agree with everything. I have a young DD and concerned about the future and just waiting for a primary school ‘talk’ - not had one as yet. Not sure who to vote for at next election - just waiting to see what each party’s stance is.
I keep mentioning things to my elderly mum and she can’t believe it either. Spoke to a woman at one of my activities and we were just chatting in a break and suddenly, not sure why we started mentioning trans but suddenly this was all spilling out. Im generally a bit wary of saying anything as I don’t want to come across as bigoted, but she was of exactly same view, sort of Emperors New Clothes.

holycheeseplant · 03/03/2018 14:32

Does anyone know anything about the neuroscience of male vs female brain formation?

I was reminded on another that I'd got Cordelia Fine's Delusions of Gender on my kindle app that I think I got free possibly on amazon prime or just with the app. Someone else got it for £1.99. Supposed to cover a lot of this.

holycheeseplant · 03/03/2018 14:34

You're going to lose hours to this and find yourself desperate to bring it up with friends, wondering how to pass on your new found knowledge without sounding utterly unhinged

Ditto. Ditto. Ditto.

Also, then you see it EVERYWHERE.

It's like being shown how to 'see' the Matrix in the Matrix.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page