Men and small children only swim sessions

[DrewBerry95]

At my local pool, there is a small children's pool and opposite is the main swimming pool. Between the two is a shared shower for both pools. Private showers are also available, but not for an immediate rinse off.

I attempted to take DS into the small pool last night, and apparently, it seems, came too close to the 'men only' swim session in the big pool whilst having a quick rinse off before I got into the pool with DS

Disclaimer: There is a sign that asks you to rinse off quickly before getting into the pool.

Upon doing so, a lifeguard (I think) came towards me in a hurried motion and said "This is men and children Under 5 only!"

I said my DS is a mere baby but, I am going into the small pool.

The reply I got was "Well please don't come within too close a proximity because this really is a male only session, with the exception of children".

I'm livid. I was rinsing off in the shared showers! After our swim, I had a look at their timetable and the session is called "swim for U5's and Dads".

Would I be completely unreasonable to attend the next session with DS, self ID'ing as a male, and father?

DH is cross I would even consider it.

A friend of mine thinks it's because the town has a very large Muslim/Pakistani population, and therefore would be interested in these types of sessions so that's why the pool have them, for business.

I disagree though, I don't know any Muslims who would be this down right rude.

I sent an email of complaint but no response yet.

I have seen the brave woman on a previous thread organising things to stop all the self ID craze and I would so love to attend but I'm not in London area. I would join her straight away in at the male swim only though

I didn't think this self ID thing was a real thing but I've been reading policies lately of some well known organisations and I'm in shock.

From what you have said in the OP, yes, it would be unreasonable. We are not seeking to elimate sex segregation (where it is appropriate), but rather challenge policies that prioritise self-identification above sex. It sounds from your op like you are just annoyed about what happened (perhaps rightly given the position of the showers). Am I missing something? Have you looked at the pool’s policy on self-ID?

Pale they're happy for self identifying males to enter ladies only areas, it seems.

They have the Swim England policy

Wow so women swim sessions are OK but male only is not? Op you are being very inconsiderate.

YABU. I'm sure you would have had the same treatment if you were a man and the session was for women and under 5s only.

You have already pointed out why they have these sessions. Would you be saying Muslim women should just accept men into women only sessions?

This has nothing to do with self ID.

It would be absolutely reasonable for you to say "I am male. I believe you have read "Swim UK" guidelines on self-ID?"

And in future you should.

I think there might be a problem if you waltzed into a men only session IDing as male and wearing only shorts.

I would have found his wording to be unnecessary and rude. There's no need to tell you not to come within too close a proximity. If you're legitimately using the shared showers prior to using a different pool then he had no business to suggest that you were in the wrong place. I'd make a complaint about how he spoke to you and the assumption that you were somehow breaking rules.

Whether or not they'd tolerate self-id-ing men or non-binary people into the men only session is a separate question.

OK, well that is a different thing and nothing to do with what happened to you at the pool or the existence of male only swim sessions. My starting point would be to write to them about the policy and go from there.

Are you hoping to challenge the Swim England policy?
Or make sure that they enforce it?

It's not clear from the OP which it is.

Making sure that the pool enforce Self-ID for the benefit of intending to infiltrate a sex segregated session is a far cry from the other thread where someone was trying to show the swimming pool how ludicrous this is.

”It would be absolutely reasonable for you to say "I am male. I believe you have read "Swim UK" guidelines on self-ID?"

And in future you should.”

This ^^

Seeing as they allow trans male to female to swim with women and enter their changing rooms etc, of course you can do the same by saying you are self IDing as a man. Go for it! I think this is the only way we will get people to notice what the fuck is going on. They don’t listen to women when it’s wimen being affected. They WILL listen when men start to be affected.

Excuse typos!

No I think challenge the policy don't demand that it is enforced as pp said.

I think it's actually great that they have a dads' swim session. AFAIK there isn't usually much demand for men only sessions - despite MRAs bleating about how unfair women only sessions are. And anything that gets men more actively involved with their children is great.

But “women-only” swimming sessions have effectively been put paid to now, thanks to Swim England’s insistence that men must be allowed to self-identify into them and to share our showers, natteringnan. So the OP is perfectly entitled to question why swimming pools are so keen to preserve single-sex facilities for men, while telling women that we require “educating” if we object to seeing male genitals when we’re showering.

I think you'd just be using the self-ID debate to get your own back for being told off.

Then when a feminist stumbles upon a session for dad's and their U5 kids she cries "this isn't fair! we are so oppressed!"

Did you read the OP natteringnan?

She was showering, in the communal showers, in between the two pools before going into the kiddies pool, and was challenged without even looking like she was going to the adult pool, and felt that's a bit off.

She doesn't have a problem with the kids/dads swim session.

however given current guidelines, there is absolutely nothing wrong with her IDing as a man to attend them, and the member of staff was entirely in the wrong for assuming that she wasn't a man just on appearances.

If you think that sounds crazy, yes, it is, but that's the rules, don't be upset at women for following the rules.

Oh dear, I’d replied to that in good faith, but I see now that we have a hairy-handed MRA with us.

I'm confused. Are you annoyed because your pool has a dad and children swim session OP?

TBH I find it more unfair that the pool near my parents' house is booked for Over 50s every single morning from 9 - 10. Why do Over 50s need their own session?

One rule for you. Another if it was the other way round. Picking everything not surprised your DH would be cross

I absolutely would ID as a man yes. Highlight to them how ridiculous it all is.

I think it's nice if men want men only sessions, good for them. Doesn't affect me at all I can go at a different time or somewhere else.