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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

We act from deep and well-thought-out conviction. But...

60 replies

JellySlice · 08/02/2018 19:15

Today we look back appalled at the women who fought against giving women the vote.

In 100 years' time will history look back on us, on gender-critical women, in the same way?

OP posts:
IndominusRex · 09/02/2018 07:39

It's the opposite. We are the suffragettes. All the women chanting TW ARE WOMEN are the ones who'd have said 'it's fine I don't want to vote anyway'

Datun · 09/02/2018 08:23

the majority of LGBs welcome and embrace

I don't know how you can say that with a straight face.

The trans ideology contradicts homosexuality on the most profound level.

Gay men are now expected to have sex with people who have female anatomy, and lesbians with people who have male anatomy.

Of course, gay men are not being put under any kind of pressure, by transmen, because transmen have no power, and aren't socialised to dominate.

Lesbians on the other hand, are subjected to the same old, same old narrative of lesbian men demanding sex. See cotton ceiling. See the thread on here from lesbians who are being persecuted.

The T has colonised the LGB, just as much as it has everywhere else.

JellySlice · 09/02/2018 08:34

the majority of LGBs welcome and embrace trans people

Really? Hmm When trans seeks to invalidate and eradicate homosexuality?

OP posts:
SomeRandomBird · 09/02/2018 09:17

Stonewall, Mind Out, Pink News, Pride, Kaleidoscope ... all the leading LGB organisations positively embrace the T. In fact can you point me to one that doesn't?

ArcheryAnnie · 13/02/2018 12:58

SomeRandomBird I was part of Stonewall when it first began. I've since broken with them over this issue, as they are throwing lesbians (and indeed all women) under the bus. They also have a "trans inclusion officer" who claims never to have met anyone who has detransitioned, which - since there are plenty, and it's an important issue in our community - means either they are lying, or that they are really shit at their job.

Personally, I welcome and embrace any trans person as long as they don't expect me to go along and submit to a belief system that erases lesbians, bisexuality and gay men, and as long as they don't attempt to steal women's privacy, resources and safety from them.

ArcheryAnnie · 13/02/2018 12:59

Oh, and Pink News is just a bunch of blokes who hate women. Nobody takes them seriously as "representing the community".

AntArcticFox · 13/02/2018 13:07

To answer this straight and without getting into particular debates:

I am not appalled that in different times people worked from a different set of assumptions.

My ancestors are thought to have been cannibals according to reports I read about Cheddar Man. I'm not appalled at this thought.

I do detest shaming. So using lines on people like "you're on the wrong side of history".
That's manipulation in the present and leaves me feeling appalled!

RedToothBrush · 13/02/2018 13:39

Eugenics was viewed as progressive and a solution to social problems at one point last century. (If you are Toby Young, it still is).

Medical ethics arose out of the idea 'do not harm' which forced doctors to stop and think about whether their intervention was actually in the best interest of the patient.

None intervention, is the default position, in the absence of evidence.

Given we are not properly studying the outcomes of trans patients and the possibility of de-transitioning, this should set off alarms.

Why?

Because in effect everyone going through this is being experimented on by its very nature. Not explicitly stating this, and not recording the long term effects on those who undergo intervention is both immoral and irresponsible.

We also know that allowing people to self-medicate is a bad idea. Yet this is actively encouraged by trans activists.

Add to this, children in particular are being encouraged to be sterilised. How can you say that a child is making an informed decision without being under duress when the science isn't there to support it, because the research has never been done?

Coerced or compulsory sterilisation has a very murky history.

So for me, if this was about rights and being progressive, then it wouldn't merely be about 'feelings'. It would be about trying to show the medical benefits in an impartial and unemotional way. It would be honest that, there is rarely a one size fits all solution here.

Not to mention that if you self ID and don't have surgery then that does put you into a different category simply because of the physical differences between the sexes and how that puts women at risk of abuse or attack. Which is why, accurate and detailed reporting and recording of crime along sex not gender lines is so important.

All that makes it wildly different to women getting the vote and decriminalising homosexuality.

Its also without looking at a whole range of other issues relating to the subject, which are harmful to women.

Njordsgrrrl · 13/02/2018 14:49

Oh I think that was me with the link to the Scottish football forum. It was a good thread and men discussing the Emperor's New Clothes does seem to carry more weight. As I said at the time, when this issue starts to affect straight men there'll be recognition.

Destinysdaughter · 13/02/2018 15:18

how long before women (not real, not cis, just women) feel obliged to cover up for self-preservation? If self-serving, self-aggrandising TIMs, with no true interest in sisterhood with women, get to define 'woman', how long before such dress codes become obligatory?

Well, In America, TRAs protested about women wearing pink pussy hats on a women's March ( a symbol of women's resistance to Trump ) as they felt it excluded them. How fucking dare they?
If they are so upset and offended by knitted hats, what's not to say that they will start to claim that seeing the outline of a woman's breasts etc is too triggering for them and we all have to cover up...?

www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/01/22/the-womens-march-was-made-unsafe-by-anti-trans-signs-and-pussy-hats/

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