Grammar school bans teachers from calling its pupils girls

[anothernetter]

... incase it 'offends' transgender children.

And so it continues.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5252471/Top-grammar-school-bans-calling-pupils-girls.html

martha I'm just very happy both friends are removing their DDs. If my DDs attended a school that dealt with a transgender issue this way I would be looking to remove them too. Terrible way to deal with an issue a child is going through.

I know two friends with DDs attending the school. When they found out about it before Christmas they started looking at other schools. They wanted their Dds to go to that school because they wanted them to embrace being girls and build up on that confidence. This decision has been taken by the parents, the fathers especially, that being a girl is less than. One friends DH has been raging about it saying that if a girl wishes to identify as a boy there needs to be a whole lot more done by the school to meet the mental health needs of the child. He was saying this change doesn't actually help a transgender child and we are on a very slippery slope if we deny the existence of girls but continue to recognize the existence of boys

I have been trying to put something like this in words. It does seem as if girls and women are being literally (word used deliberately) erased - and this is by the same school that nixed girls being involved in a campaign about feminism. One of the advantages of a girls' school, I would have thought, is that girls and women and the achievements of girls and women can be celebrated openly and positively, countering gendered and sexist norms and messages outside the school. If gendered words can no longer be used then this purpose would seem to be defeated. It's a linguistic invisibilising. It's very sad.

She said the bullying was horrendous, with high instances of anorexia, MH issues, all swept under the carpet

Yes, well I see a pattern there!

They seem to want the categories to be Man and Other. Autogynephiles want women to vanish because our existence makes it harder to pretend that they're women, and since they can't make us literally vanish erasing any linguistic references to us is the next best thing. Misogynists of all stripes agree that this is a wonderful idea.

If the ability to name female humans as a group is removed from the language then it becomes much harder to advocate for the groups formerly referred to as women and girls, which suits the kind of people who'd rather we stop advocating for ourselves nicely.

This was my school in the late 80s. I swore that if I had a daughter there was no way on earth I would send her there. It was entirely results driven, with little to no pastoral care. Obvious anorexia was ignored and bullying was endemic.

That said, I can’t imagine that the head at the time would have bought into this. The fact we were girls was relevant because of the competition with the boys school - we consistently outperformed the boys and we were told daily that girls and young women could do and be anything.

My old school! It is very funny that the school are using the hashtag #altygirls, to defend their position.

duchess My friends and their DHs decided on the school for their DDs because they wanted that environment where girls are told they can do and be anything. Sad part is they can't be girls.

At least there are lots of excellent schools in the area. I wouldn't be surprised if this puts off a lot of parents sending their DC there. A high number of the girls come from typically conservative ethnic backgrounds. I can't see those groups accepting this.

DD and 2 friends have come home from school this afternoon. I asked about the pupil who had allegedly committed suicide and they had no idea whatsoever about this and don't think that it is true. So unless it is something that happened years ago, I think it is unlikely.

I think the mistake that the school has made was sending out the letter to parents. They could have had a subtle policy of not addressing pupils with the G word - it's not that hard to leave it out if it causes upset. Teachers use all sorts of strategies to manage their classrooms without statements having to be issued. The issue in the school now will be "Whose parent has told the press?"

the most poignant fact I remember is seeing the suicide rate being less than 20% in blue states here in America where people are a whole lot more accepting and less judgmental and more than 75% in the southern Bible Belt states.

Eh? Do you mean 75% of trans people commit suicide in the bible belt in the USA? I don't believe either 75% or 20% tbh. Unless I'm missing something?

It's the % of trans people who have attempted suicide on an annual basis.

“It's the % of trans people who have attempted suicide on an annual basis“

The statistics about suicide among trans people are very dodgy indeed, and need to be approached with care.

No that can't be right. Seriously. That's the dodgiest stat ever.

This is going to sound cold but if 75% of any group were attempting suicide every year I'd expect the overall numbers of that group to be dropping rather rapidly. Instead the overall number of trans people seems to be increasing, so either trans people are for some unexplained reason not very good at figuring out effective methods or the statistic is bunk.

It's the % of trans people who have attempted suicide on an annual basis

Don't be ridiculous. Is this kind of nonsense actually believed by people?

www.transgendertrend.com/a-scientist-reviews-transgender-suicide-stats/

What you need to consider is whether depressed and anxious teens, who are the group where you might expect to find suicide attempts, are identifying as trans (and the mental health problems are not effectively tackled); or whether being trans is a standalone thing, and it is rejection and bullying which leads to suicide attempts. Or as most likely a combination.

I'm local to this and know someone with a daughter there. From what I've heard this is half a dozen pupils being extremely vocal, and everyone else rolling their eyes. Apparently the pupils in question are unwilling to consider changing to the Boys school (or indeed the mixed grammar down the road) because they don't identify as boys, they identify as gender fluid.

But it's a girls school, not a gender fluid school. If they want a gender fluid school maybe they should demand that one be created rather than pestering their teachers into feats of linguistic stupidity.

"From what I've heard this is half a dozen pupils being extremely vocal, and everyone else rolling their eyes. Apparently the pupils in question are unwilling to consider changing to the Boys school (or indeed the mixed grammar down the road) because they don't identify as boys, they identify as gender fluid."

What an easy and appealing way to exert control over your teachers. I'm guessing the school can't do right for doing wrong. In seeking external advice they'd have been directed to one of the trans-activist support groups who lump everyone under the same umbrella. They probably thought they were doing the right thing and had no other support to tell them to do differently.

It certainly seems to be a ‘thing’ at the moment. At least two of DDs friends have changed their names and are not being referred to by a specific gender. They are ‘pan’. They are 13 year old girls.
They haven’t developed the ability to think critically about gender and politics, strikes me that it’s a populist fad which appeals as it goes against what us parents understand. As teenagers do. It makes me sad that they are rejecting womanhood because we, as their mothers, have a group of very strong female friendships, which to me embodies all that is good about womanhood.

Agree this is a fad, albeit a dangerous one inasmuch as these 'gender fluid' teenagers are unwittingly helping to undermine women's rights. Also agree this is a very quick'n'easy way of exerting power over teachers and getting attention from everyone.

Presumably the school is for children of the female biological sex. If only the schools had simply straightened its spine and stated that staff would be continuing to refer to their pupils' sex rather than their gender.

How can people be gender fluid or identify as girls when girls aren't allowed to exist?

You can't be what doesn't exist

WRT stats, I questioned the high percentages and they explained that there are very very few transgender people in the south. They move to the coasts (San Fran, LA or NYC) so you might have 10 people who identify as transgender in the population and then you get data from attempted suicides which says 7 or 8 people tried to commit suicide. The rate of homelessness for transgender people was high and incomes much lower on average as getting hired/promoted is much more challenging.

Either way, after seeing what my colleague went through I can see the issues. The silent discrimination was very real. This was someone going through some very tough personal issues and people were just very hands off in terms of helping him with his work. He was never invited out for drinks by peers. I raised this with him and fought hard to make sure he got time to talk to someone weekly about these issues. The rejection was from his family, the majority of colleagues and some friends. If you don't have a therapist I can see how this escalates to attempting suicide.

I don't have any issues with someone wanting to identify as a different gender but I do have a big issue with eliminating a gender which is what has happened here.

Want2bsupermum, can't you see that you have been sold a lie?

This is obviously nonsense.

Did they provide any sources for their ridiculous claims?

I mean come on, you could even perform a basic Google search.

Red states such as Alabama, North Carolina, Louisana, Tennessee, Mississippi have above average numbers of transgender people.

(THis is because of black homophobia, as I understand, far from the transgender movement's claims, becoming transgender is in many cases a reaction to homophobia - black & Hispanic people are disproportionately more likely to be transgender, and white people disproportionately less likely)

Incidentally, WHY do trans lobbyists insist on always using irrelevant American examples for their campaigning? We are not in America, we don't have a religious right here, for example. We don't have a high homicide rate. We have extremely low rates of transgender homicide here. The American anecdata are irrelevant nonsense.

Umm because I live in America and the center I went to is based in NYC.

My employee going through a transition was Hispanic. Family rejected him, friends stopped inviting him out and I knew he felt very alone. Myself along with a partner support him. As a parent I can't imagine what he or his parents are going through. It's not what I would want for my DC.

My DD goes to the school in question. According to her, most if not all of the girls are happy with the change and care about their peers wellbeing. I believe transgenders at the school should be allowed to stay it's a single sex school, not gender and it could disrupt their learning if they've started their GCSEs for example. Also, the head teacher has changed since the feminism business so I don't think you can link them :)