Vogue’s transgender ‘suffragette’ and a licence to bully women

[ContemporaryPankhurst]

I am a Labour Party woman and often very much disagree with Caroline Farrow however I think this article of hers is great.

www.conservativewoman.co.uk/vogues-transgender-suffragette-licence-bully-women/

I would be interested to hear other people's opinions on this.

I think she's got a nerve. It was the Tories that introduced the GRA and trashed the Equality Act, not Vogue.

It’s conservative with a small c. I think it’s a great article.

My Labour party MP was an early day motion signatory on the GRA - there is cross party crazy on this one.

Thank you Redonionricedpotato, i'm not well acquainted with the source.

Refreshing to see that clearly in print. Also interesting that the comments criticizing the article use no actual reasoning or debate.

And threaten 'justified violence' - always the fall back position. It's just so .... male.

I think her statement about Paris Lees is a hate crime.
So she's the one to start the backlash and shout 'pc gone mad', is she? I wondered who'd be given that privilege.

The Tories are going to distance themselves from the whole mess. Labour will pick up the baton and run with it.

In what sense a "hate crime" ink? The author is quoting Paris' own words and questioning what Paris has done to benefit women generally to deserve being feted as a new suffragette. Seems a reasonable argument not a hate crime.

You think which statement about Paris Lees is a hate crime, Irk? That Paris Leesus not a woman? Stating a biological, scientific fact is not a hate crime. A woman is an adult human female. Lees is an adult male who has had surgery to make him look female. And Caroline Farrow is most certainly not a lone voice in opposing his inclusion in a list of ‘new suffragettes’.

Lees and those like him are ironically the ones doing their own cause harm. The obnoxious way they come across. No one likes to be shouted at, it's an American thing I think, telling folk to shut up and not express an opinion. Only Trans should be listened to in discussions about it kind of thing.

The law has been changed for a while in Ireland and I haven't seen or heard someone even remotely like Lees. Maybe she's doing it wrong, like she's doing woman wrong.

Also I'm sure all this drunk straight fellas in Ibiza would be fine to be tricked like that

I would go absolutely off my head if I was put in that position by a Trans person.

"Hate crime" OMG some people need to get perspective here, that comment is utterly ridiculous.

it's an American thing I think, telling folk to shut up and not express an opinion

jesus fucking christ.

Great article by the way.

I don't give a fuck if it was a Tory who wrote it. Labour have abandoned women. I'm done with them

It's in my interests to vote Tory, although I never have. There are many women in the same situation I would think. I don't want to but if they are the only party which will oppose this, I will.

Jess Phillips is pissing me off today too, and I always liked her

*it's an American thing I think, telling folk to shut up and not express an opinion

jesus fucking christ.

Great article by the way*

Yeah it is. The only people who can talk about Trans is trans people. The only people who can talk about women's problems are women. Same for minorities. I'd never seen this kind of discourse this side of the pond untill this rubbish started in America, had you?

It's the stupifying of a generation. Don't have an opinion.

Great article.

These have been great, i'm glad others feel the same about the Labour Party - i'm hoping to question the madness from the inside but I am at my limit with it at the moment.

Hate crime, please pick something as a particular example and explain as I don't understand. You have not made an argument and it appears to be a silencing tactic. I would like to give you an opportunity to make your case but so far I am not convinced.

I currently feel that the trans ideology is a backlash, it is the worst kind of misogyny we have faced since pre-suffrage. It is a backlash and women are now the hated, silenced group which the anger from an economic down turn has been turned on. It is based on sexist stereotypes and the commodification of the female body.

I genuinely believe that they will go for consent laws next in terms of age. There is already a lecturer at Glasgow arguing that the age of consent is a feminist construct - 'The Age of Consent: Young People, Sexuality, and Citizenship' by Matthew Waites.

Very to the point good article, does it matter who wrote it.

Really Contemporary?

There was a big twitter spat with that dude today, fecking arsehole that he is. He's a Gender studies lecturer. He is one of the bollox responsible for all this shit

twitter.com/MatthewWaites/status/949835403317665792

With the Guardian, I tried it as an experiment. I posted below this article (which is a good and valid article), entitled: "Vogue’s ‘New Suffragettes’: where are the women with disabilities?" www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/07/vogue-new-suffragettes-women-disabilities
Been a poster since 2008 and had maybe a dozen posts deleted in that time. But tonight - three posts deleted and I've been put on the moderation naughty step, because I wrote, three times, politely, that Paris Lees is a trans woman, not a woman!

Women are being banned from Twitter for saying that, on the grounds of hate speech.

I'd never seen this kind of discourse this side of the pond untill this rubbish started in America, had you?

I live in america. the trans movement seems far more strident and anti-women in the UK than it does here.

If you want to blame america for it, feel free - you are in the right place. Most of mumsnet blames the US for everything from vulgar halloween decorations to brexit. That won't actually deal with the issue before you though but it will make you feel all superior to the nasty yanks.

Really good piece from Caroline Farrow. Bit depressing when it's the Tories who are talking the most sense.

StillPissedOff: I had a similar experience to you. I've been commenting on the Guardian for years - am always very polite, rarely have comments deleted. But a few weeks ago I put a couple of mildly dissenting comments on an article about trans issues - the comments were all deleted and, like you, I got put on the "naughty step". Yesterday I commented on the Frances Ryan article that Paris Lees wasn't a woman and the comment was instantly deleted.

That's it - I wasn't rude, I didn't use bad language, I didn't insult anyone or say anything libellous. These days your comments are deleted for simply stating an objective fact. Hard to believe that this is the once-great Guardian which in the 1970s brought feminist writers to the forefront in a largely-chauvinistic Fleet Street.

Wow I am amazed at that censorship by the Guardian. So anyone who disagrees would think they are in the minority whereas in fact they are probably in the majority, it's just that all dissenting voices have been removed. That is terrible.

Having read the article, the best I can say is that that's 2 minutes of my life I won't get back.

Not one single intelligible reasonable thought. Not a one. Just false analogies, straw men and an excuse for a transphobic rant.

Women are being banned from Twitter for saying that, on the grounds of hate speech.

Threatening to rape, batter and murder women who are off message is perfectly ok and left to stand though. So Twitter can't really be considered as having actual standards or integrity or even basic coherence on a moderation policy.