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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Monmouth MP David Davies (who I'm not a fan of in many ways, but anywho...) not very popular with transpeople at the mo

12 replies

BeyondQueenOfLists · 15/08/2017 19:05

www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/15459080.BEHIND_THE_HEADLINES__The_great_transgender_debate/

"What they need to realise is that there are people with concerns with the direction this is going, and I’m one of them. Most people are not willing to express those concerns in a public place because of the sort of disgraceful abuse you’re subjected to.”

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VestalVirgin · 15/08/2017 19:38

Never heard of the guy, but he comes across as a rather reasonable and sane person in comparison to his enemies.

The trans commenter's refusal to apologize for the hate spewed at Mr. Davies (I can well imagine what sort of thing it was ...) all the while claiming that HE should apologize for expressing concern over the wellbeing of women, was very telling.

BlessedBeTheFruit · 15/08/2017 19:44

Yes he comes across as reasonable. I don't know anything about him, other than he surely must be less annoying than David Davis.

BeyondQueenOfLists · 15/08/2017 20:42

He's only marginally less of a nob - voted against gay marriage and doesn't believe in climate change!

But he does come across as very very reasonable on this. I hate to think of the views hiding behind the reasonable facade though...

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VestalVirgin · 15/08/2017 20:49

He's only marginally less of a nob - voted against gay marriage and doesn't believe in climate change!

When guys like this are the reasonable side of a debate, you know the end of the world is near. Confused

BeyondQueenOfLists · 15/08/2017 20:58

Indeed, vestal Confused

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Icantreachthepretzels · 15/08/2017 22:07

If he's against gay marriage and a climate change denier then he is probably coming at this from a genuine transphobic, rightwing, men should men sort of place and not from a genuine place of caring about women's rights.

I was going to feel sorry for him for practically sharing David Davis' name but I will withhold my sympathy for now.

Rumandraisin1 · 16/08/2017 13:19

He's only marginally less of a nob - voted against gay marriage and doesn't believe in climate change!

When guys like this are the reasonable side of a debate, you know the end of the world is near.

Stonewall, who are pushing for this legislation, were also against gay marriage so there is a history-of-nobbishness on both sides - although Stonewall are sticking with theirs by supporting an agenda that is extremely harmful to LGB people.

Datun · 16/08/2017 13:48

Rumandraisin1

although Stonewall are sticking with theirs by supporting an agenda that is extremely harmful to LGB people.

How is that even happening?

Are people just, as usual, too scared to say anything?

How can Stonewall, of all people, advocate for the erasure of sexual orientation?

BlessedBeTheFruit · 16/08/2017 14:11

Datun didn't someone say on one of these threads that Stonewall had their funding cut massively, but then added the T bit in to what they did so they could get more funding. Don't know if that's true or not though.

Rumandraisin1 · 16/08/2017 14:14

I think people generally are too scared to say anything but, in particular within actual LGBT organisations or groups saying anything which even remotely questions the trans agenda would lead to you being thrown out.

Without wanting to get too specific, I know a service user of an LGBT group with a learning disability who asked a question which was not at all attacking trans people but just trying to understand and it was deemed offensive, she was treated really badly and, although she has been allowed back to access services after repeatedly apologising and saying that it was just due to her disability that she hadn't understood or had phrased her question wrongly, she was made to feel really uncomfortable accessing services. If you actually genuinely questioned anything, you would definitely get banned.

As a service user, you have to just decide either to stop accessing LGB-specific services/groups or to go and keep your mouth shut (in lesbian groups which now have a very heavy presence not just of transsexuals, who have always been around but the more modern, domineering 'trans' individuals, including, yes individuals who haven't done as much as shave off their beard but apparently are lesbians now).

Even in my job (in a non-LGBT organisation), I wouldn't be allowed to express anything which questioned the trans agenda so I imagine that the only option for someone working in an LGBT organisation like Stonewall who wanted to protect the rights of LGB people would be to leave their job.

VestalVirgin · 16/08/2017 14:25

Rum, that's shocking!

I think it is high time that actual feminists set up their own groups.

This person you know should have access to the services she needs without having to kiss the asses of those genderists. It is brainwashing, and that they do it even to vulnerable people (no big surprise, of course) makes me very angry.

Datun · 16/08/2017 14:35

Rumandraisin1

Sadly I have heard of this experience all too often.

And whilst I understand the censorship leaving people with no choice but to shut up, or leave, surely, surely there must be LGB people who can't agree with it?

They spent so long campaigning for the 'born this way' to be accepted.

Trans advocates asserting that is now a choice, that you need to work through, is undoing all of it.

BlessedBeTheFruit

Yes, I believe that's true. I had heard it from several sources already.

I wonder if Stonewall is now just completely trans. That the LGB is now such a minority that the power dynamic is totally one-sided.

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