Motherhood and degradation

[roadtorumba]

I really need to get this off my chest and I'm hoping it comes across the way I'm intending it to.
I do love being a mother, but with it has come this sense of degradation almost. Going from working full time before children, to having my free time respected, my opinions and ideas valued in the work place things feel much different. Even in the way I'm viewed at home by my partner. I can't help but sense that he feels it my duty to take on most of the domestic drudgery, even though he 'claims' to do his fair share. And working part time had a massive knock on effect on my self esteem when I had no idea wheb meetings were taking place, what was discussed in them on my days off, u suddenly didn't get my thoughts heard. It was really weird. I felt I suddenly became a martyr to child rearing in the eyes of society, worthy of little else.
I feel a little ashamed to use the term 'degrading' to describe my experience of becoming a mother from a societical perspective.
There was a definite change in the way I was viewed by my partner at home; as if the house suddenly became my domain. Has anyone else experienced similar? How to break it? How to feel a little more empowered?

I sympathise. It does totally change the dynamics. Get a rota in place at home, A written one that makes it clear what jobs are yours and what aren't. So you ringfence your contribution and what is expected of others, rather than being seen as a sahm who works now and again.

At work schedule in a hand over session after the days when you are off, so you start your run of working days being briefed, (like a boss) not running around trying to catch up (like an intern) 😆

I have written down all the main household tasks in a rough timetable of when they are done. It's not rigid but it's clear that in a normal week laundry happens every day, and other tasks weekly, so proper clean of kitchen one day, bathroom another day etc. It means that all this stuff isn't just in my head and there is no reason for DP to ask what needs doing, and effectively become my assistant, while I manage the workload.

I know exactly what you mean.

I'm frayed at the edges now, trying to work full time and look after the kids - and all the help we've tried to buy in (cleaner, nanny, after school club/whatever) has only slightly worked in that it's just flaky round here - cleaners decide not to bother turning up, nanny the same, after school club cancelled with 15 mins notice (even if available) etc.)

I've told DP that I'm going to wind down my job, and that if he takes a promotion that's on the table, I'm going to stop working (although I'll keep my hand in in a hobby capacity - this is possible in my line of work) because it's doing none of us any good. I might even consider a 3rd kid if that happens.

BUT having said that, the thought that he'll then feel justified in expecting me to pick up his socks (at the moment he's just lazy about it - and that's not a good example to the kids) is one that doesn't sit well with me. Some firm boundaries will need to continue to be enforced. I'll be home for my mental health, and the good of the family, not to be his personal skivvy.

What has helped now, while I'm freelance? Disappearing - leaving DP with the kids when he's home and I need to work - either shutting myself in a room and refusing to answer, or preferably actually leaving the house. Ignoring stuff (shut the door and ignore clothes everywhere, breakfast stuff un tidied etc. - I'm at work, it's not my problem). Making sure that DP has assigned tasks and does them (taking kids to school, putting them to bed) - no skipping a day and assuming I'll take over without pre-arrangement. I do have a timetable for the kids, and if DP misses a sports day or performance, that's his problem. If he feels left out, he has all the tools available to him to be involved that I do.

Above all, I've cultivated a blazé attitude - I'm important, I'm involved at work and at home, but I'm not servile about either. If I have to start work late, I inform my colleagues, I don't apologise for it (I'm freelance, so I can). If I don't clean something (ha! Perhaps that should be 'When I don't clean anything') or dinner is from the freezer, then it is what it is, I didn't have time - and my time is as valuable as anyone else's.

I felt exactly the same as you. And the worse thing was I wasn't a "natural" mother, so I felt forced into this role that I wasn't particularly good at. It wrecked my self esteem, and I felt like a failure everywhere - work, home, school gates. Still do really.

I know what you mean but I dont know how to deal with it Lists dont work with the type of people who think its ok to throw their dirty balled up socks on the floor for the serf to pick up. They just add more mental work to the load.

Parenthood (and as most primary carers are mothers, that's mostly motherhood), being a 'homemaker', doing the 101 tasks necessary to bringing up a child - isn't respected by
i) most men (why is it that a minority of fathers choose to be the prime carer or work part time?) and
ii) most people who have never had children (the average 20 yr old looks on in disgust as a parents cleans a snotty nose while balancing a half eaten rice cake on the tube).

So that's probably more than half of society sneering.

And if you dare to try to continue working at any kind of level that gives a semblance of financial independence you'll be reviled as a cold hearted career bitch. Including by other mothers.

Nothing will change until there is serious recognition of the need for more part time job opportunities, working hours that reflect school hours, more job shares, more flexible working (as standard rather than dribs and drabs begged for) - and crucially an expectation that all parents, men and women, will be able to take up those opportunities without feeling reviled, without changing the balance of power in their relationships, without giving up financial independence and locking themselves into poverty or unhappy relationships.

There have been changes since the 1950s, of course there have - but a lot of it is just window dressing.

You're right, DJ - the list I've made only works for us because DP doesn't actually think that everything in the home is my job. I have had to push him to take responsibility for things himself, rather than act like he's helping me, but because when I explained it to him like that he knew it wasn't right, he was willing to work on it and now does a lot more. I do still find it annoying that I've had to teach him how to run a home, as I don't believe I ought to be left with a job I think his parents should have done. PIL have very gendered roles, while I was brought up by a single mum so my expectations of DP are probably much higher than many.

I've found the low status of 'mother' to be one of the hardest things to deal with. I'm not really interested in status, and have never felt defined by my career so that wasn't a problem. I had also spent the last few years in a very demanding job and was a bit burnt out, so I was glad of a change. What really rankles with me is the general perception that I'm faced with. People sighing when I'd walk into a cafe to feed my baby, because how dare someone bother them by bringing a baby into the public space they were using. People acting like I take up too much space, that I can't be doing anything important so they can keep me waiting while they deal with someone with actual stuff to do. People acting like I'm not a full person, because I have a baby, so must have instantly become some sort of stereotype. And none of this has happened to DP. People seem to treat him like he has a brain still.

People sighing when I'd walk into a cafe to feed my baby, because how dare someone bother them by bringing a baby into the public space they were using

Can I just say I think this sense of annoying others merely by having children is very much a UK thing. In my husband's culture, people smile when they see babies, often reach out, play with them and generally make you feel like a human who is contributing to the world! I sat behind two very heavily made-up women in their twenties on a recent flight and I'm ashamed to say I slightly judged their see-through tops/bras showing as a bit superficial, then then proceeded to play so nicely with the little girl in front of them, for the whole flight. No annoyance, no 'we're too good for this'. I had the same experience on a flight with my dd with a young man in his twenties and I even asked my husband if this was normal I was so suspicious. The UK isn't a culture that likes children, even if there are a lot of consumer things for them (softplay etc), and I think that contributes to your general sense of not being valued as a mother.

I'd agree with you - when I've been in other European countries children seem to be welcomed much more into society. People seem happy for them to be in restaurants, for example.

In the UK I get the feeling that children are supposed to stay in the designated areas and not bother anyone else by alerting them to their existence. I'm not saying that everyone is horrible to me all the time so I hide indoors, I do loads, and lots of people are lovely, but the overwhelming attitude I experience is negative.

I agree with that regarding kids - other places I've lived have been so tolerant of kids - genuinely pleased to see them in a restaurant for example. In the UK they shove a cheap set of crayons at them and think that's it (please.. why the crayons. Who's idea was giving kids something to scribble with that they can drop!).

HOWEVER - in other places, motherhood is still very much a thing - very many more women where I am now are SAHM. There's an expectation that someone will be in the house to accept deliveries etc. and that's been the case in a number of places I've lived.

The UK seems to be having trouble finding its way through so many women working, and what in that case, that means for parents and kids.

On the SAHM side, I don't think any mother who works is a cold hearted career bitch at all. Otoh, I find that the instant I say I am at home with the children, I am dismissed as not worth talking to and also held in contempt for setting a bad example to my daughters by not having a career.
I guess the point is that mothers can never get it right.

Isay, I know what you mean. Someone recently asked me if I miss using my brain. I said, no I never enjoyed it, too tiring.

I do work freelance at nap time and in the evening, and to be honest it's horrible. I don't get any sort of break when it's a busy time and the house falls to pieces as I'm literally working every spare minute, so it's not as pleasant an environment than I feel I have time to do some housework.

Yes, it's not just my responsibility, but when I have more work on, DP isn't around the house more, so can't make up for it adequately.

You know, I'd like to see the person who said that to you break up a brewing fight between a 6 yo, a 4 yo and a 3 yo. Don't tell me that doesn't need a brain. Strategic diplomacy right there.

I really do wonder what she expected me to say - yes, I wish I could work more but now my brain has fallen out?

Isay, I know what you mean. Someone recently asked me if I miss using my brain. I said, no I never enjoyed it, too tiring

ROFL - I shall have to use that one!

I do work freelance at nap time and in the evening, and to be honest it's horrible. I don't get any sort of break when it's a busy time and the house falls to pieces as I'm literally working every spare minute, so it's not as pleasant an environment than I feel I have time to do some housework

YES THIS. I'm burning the candle at both ends, and something's got to give, so at this point, screw it. I'm going to make my kids happy, have a nice house, home cooked meals, and go back to a proper job only if it's right. No compromises. Frankly, our partnership isn't going to survive the bitterness if I continue to try to work full time, whilst he doesn't pick up after himself. I feel much more inclined to indulge his laziness if I have actually had a moment to myself at some point during the day rather than working whenever the kids aren't around.

Ah yes, the using your brain thing...

Ultimately being a sah mum or a carer is not valued, as it does not get paid.

Saying that, I am a sahm (well, I work part time) and value myself. I think looking after the home and the family can be pretty hard work.

I think I do a pretty good job. I don't pick up DH clothes of floor or iron his shirts btw.

Had to draw a few lines in the sand when I became a sahm!

Excellent posts on here.

The other thing I think doesn't occur to men is the fact that you have to be emotionally available for your children.

So after all the chores are done and dusted, and you've gone to bed, little things are still niggling away.

Why are they being bullied? How can you improve their self-esteem? That essay wasn't finished, was it?

When they are teens. I would worry until they were home. DH would be snoring away.

The mental load generates investment. Just through the sheer amount of time you spend with somebody (kids) and concentrating on their issues.

Thanks for all the replies on here! So insightful and interesting! I just feel as a part-time teacher and part-SAHM that I'm doing everything pretty badly.
DP thinks I'm sure that the house should be tickety-boo running like clockwork seeing as I now 'only' work part time although he never says this it's a strong feeling I get from him. I sense his confusion when I need him to do 50% of the chores at weekends because I've had my hands full with children and work during the week!
Then when at work, I can't give 100% because I miss importsnt things on days off as I have no idea what's happening a lot of the time. Ive applied for promotions and been unsuccessful since working part-time, and I know that one of these was because I wasn't in work every day and it was argued that I would need to be. Made me feel very inadequate.
I definitely sense society's view that by becoming a mother, you're somehow no.longer making a valuable contribution to society. It's difficult to work out a way forward from this mindset.

He should think of the childcare as hours you cannot do chores. It's sometimes possible for me to do quick things like put a wash on, empty the dishwasher, but honestly, it's not always going to happen. It wouldn't have happened if I was out at work, either.

If you're working 3 days and looking after children 2, then you're working full time.

Thanks Basket. I do 3:2. It's the extra stuff with child rearing like remembering to buy presents for their friends parties, noticing they need more pants, that they have outgrown their shoes etc. It's really a full time job in itself, so.I have the utmost respect for SAHMS who do it all!

Personally I've always found part time colleagues to be more efficient than full time ones. They usually use all their work time actually working, while people who are about all the time tend to fill those hours less efficiently. Part timers haven't tended to wind down of a Friday afternoon in my experience.

All the extra things are harder to do at the weekend, as well, because the shops are busier, so buying shoes takes longer.

In my case, DP is quick to do nappy changing when he's around, and will take more of the lead when he can, but there are some things that while he wouldn't be doing them directly, I'm surprised he's never even thought about. He didn't look at the vaccination schedule, he has never trimmed her nails, even when she's scratched him in the face. He can take her out for a few hours and doesn't have to think about what she had for breakfast and what we've got for dinner when he gives her lunch, because it's just once a week so it doesn't matter if she had toast for breakfast and a sandwich for lunch.

Have to go to work so don't have much time but wanted to post this article:

www.morningstaronline.co.uk/a-2021-Time-to-pay-all-mothers-and-carers-a-living-wage#.WV3ksojyvIU

Thanks Holdbacktherain. Very interesting article!