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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Wonder Woman

53 replies

BabyLedWhining · 03/06/2017 01:24

deadline.com/2017/06/wonder-woman-captain-underpants-weekend-box-office-opening-1202106462/amp/

Posttrack showed that women over 25 (37%) led the charge into theaters, followed by men over 25 (35%), then men under 25 (15%) and women under 25 (13%).

Well this is awkward, after 50 years of action movies for men it turns out women like them too? Who knew? Why didn't they say something?

OP posts:
IWillCrushYouLikeABug · 09/06/2017 23:36

Do you think the 100 million it made was from male comic book readers? whattodo? Hmm um no. And as the op points out it is mostly women who are going to see it. Many of whom would have been fans of the Tv show too and actual real live readers of comics

IWillCrushYouLikeABug · 09/06/2017 23:38

I assume vestal they're worried that if they don't advertise it as a dudebro film the men won't come. Because ew chicks. It's not being marketed that way here or in the states luckily though.

WhatToDoAboutThis2017 · 10/06/2017 00:26

IWillCrushYouLikeABug I didn't say it was. I said it was marketed for men at that particular cinema because males are the majority of comic book readers.

nooka · 10/06/2017 02:29

Apparently it's a 45:55 female male split in comic book readership, so the perception that comics are a male preserve isn't really true

Here is a European look at people who like comics on Facebook (as there's no real way to tell the sex of those who buy comic books).

I suspect it's more the idea that while women might go see things aimed primarily at men, men won't see things they think are aimed at women.

WhatToDoAboutThis2017 · 10/06/2017 02:50

I suspect it's more the idea that while women might go see things aimed primarily at men, men won't see things they think are aimed at women.

But Wonder Woman isn't aimed at women, nor do men think it is. All guys I know that see the DC/Marvel films have seen WW because it's part of the universe and don't see it (or any of the DC/Marvel films) as being aimed at either gender.

MrsTerryPratchett · 10/06/2017 03:02

It's more worrying than that, I think. Men won't watch women. Women will watch men. So badly that my daughter can't find a hoodie with Jessie, Buzz and Woodie in it, even a 'boy's' one. My friends DS went to school with a T that included Leah and was ridiculed for wearing a girl. Even though Darth, Han, Luke et al were all there too.

WhatToDoAboutThis2017 · 10/06/2017 03:08

Men won't watch women. Women will watch men.

I just don't think that's true at all. I don't know anyone who wouldn't watch WW because the main character is female. All the people I know who won't see it won't see it because they don't like comic book films.

Main female characters are usually in films that aren't tailored to men, like romances and chick flicks. So of course they won't watch them because the storyline isn't interesting to them.

All the films where there are main female characters that are action, horror, genres men in general tend to watch, are watched by men. Men don't refuse to watch them because of the women.

MrsTerryPratchett · 10/06/2017 03:50

The main character might be female. Her entire team is male. Name a film with a 90% female cast (very common the other way around) that is popular with men. I can name ten the other way that women watch.

  1. Magic Mike
  2. etc.
WhatToDoAboutThis2017 · 10/06/2017 04:06

If a film existed that was in a genre men watched (ie. it was a subject they found interesting) that was a 90% female cast then yes, I believe they would watch it.

IWillCrushYouLikeABug · 10/06/2017 07:05

Like ghostbusters and Mad Max?

EmpressOfTheSpartacusOceans · 10/06/2017 07:26

I loved it too. Especially the island.

It was just a bit depressing that once Diana left, all the other characters except for Steve's PA and the villain were male.

Middleoftheroad · 10/06/2017 07:36

It was entertaining and both sons enjoyed it. On the way home I showed them the original TV intro
'in her satin tights, fighting for her rights' wtf????

IWillCrushYouLikeABug · 10/06/2017 07:40

Oh I love that bit middle it genuinely makes me lol every time

OneFlewOverTheDodosNest · 10/06/2017 07:45

I saw it last night and really enjoyed but I agree that it was disappointing to go from an amazing island run by women to having pretty much no more woman to woman conversations for the rest of the film. It made it all the more obvious that women aren't allowed to talk to each other in most films...

emilybrontescorset · 10/06/2017 07:47

I saw it and enjoyed it. It was dp who wanted to see it.
I loved the island scenes but I train with female bodybuilders so it wasn't unusual for me to see strong women fighting g/training.
I loved the fact that the females had athletic bodies and that ww wasn't cast as a babie doll type with an unattainable body shape tottering around in stilettos.
My criticism would be gnat the war scenes were too long.

WhatToDoAboutThis2017 · 10/06/2017 14:13

Like ghostbusters and Mad Max?

I don't know anything about Mad Max, but the new Ghostbusters wasn't watched because it was a spectacularly awful film. The fact it has a mostly female cast is irrelevant.

M0stlyBowlingHedgehog · 10/06/2017 14:28

Re. the new Ghostbusters, what do you mean by "not a good film"? Clearly, it wasn't a good film in the sense that it wasn't a deep and meaningful arthouse meditation on the vicissitudes of the human condition - but blockbusters aren't meant to be in that niche. It was a fast-moving action film. What're the appropriate standards to judge something of that genre?

Reasonably fast moving and semi-coherent plot (I've never seen a blockbuster that didn't require some suspension of disbelief from its audience - the question is simply a matter of how much - too much and the audience get pissed off).

Within the 2-d cardboard cutout restrictions of the genre, reasonably likeable characters with a decent amount of interaction and sparking off one another.

A reasonably creepy bad guy.

Judged on those standards, I thought the new ghostbusters did a good job - and I enjoyed it. The female leads were funny and bounced off one another, and I loved Chris Hemsworth asking the question "what would a male dumb blonde stereotype look like?" (I still giggle at the thought of "do you prefer the photo of me playing the sax or listening to the sax?")

So bottom line, you hated it (and you weren't alone in that), I loved it (and I wasn't alone in that). So far, so "de gustibus non est disputandum." And it was undoubtedly the case that there was a misogynistic back-lash against the mere idea of Ghostbusters with a female cast (online abuse way before the film's release). But I can't see that it failed to tick the boxes of a successful action blockbuster (unlike, for example, Batman and Robin, which failed the "plot must bounce along at a reasonable speed" test, and failed it spectacularly, or Tomorrow Never Dies - weediest Bond villain ever, totally lacking in menace).

IWillCrushYouLikeABug · 10/06/2017 15:19

Ghostbusters was universally panned before a cast was even decided on. Because holy shit ghostbusters can't have vaginas. SAME as mad Max. Also it was funny, and if you rewatch the original male films you'll see they were not master classses in theatre but stupid slapstick comedies with a huge dose of sexism that we all look back nostalgically on (as future generations of children will do the reboot)

WhatToDoAboutThis2017 · 10/06/2017 16:45

This sums it up more eloquently that I ever could:

www.slashfilm.com/disappointed-by-paul-feigs-ghostbusters/

MrsTerryPratchett · 10/06/2017 17:22

What men need is a good film, in a genre they like, and then we can judge if they would watch this 90% female cast film and see if they watch it. If one ever gets made.

They go and see Transformers, though; big steaming pile of shite that it is.

WhatToDoAboutThis2017 · 10/06/2017 17:55

Yeah, DH saw the first Transformers and then refused to see the rest Grin

IWillCrushYouLikeABug · 10/06/2017 20:25

Terry mean. It's not sexism, transformers and Too fast Too Furious 26 are just really quality film making! Grin

ChocChocPorridge · 10/06/2017 20:52

Men won't watch women. Women will watch men

It starts young - take a survey of cbeebies some time. There's this (I think self-fulfilling) belief that boys will only watch cartoons with boys in, whereas girls will watch anything.

VestalVirgin · 10/06/2017 20:58

I loved it too. Especially the island.

How much of the film takes place on the island?

If the rest of the film fails the Bechdel test, then it might not be worth watching, to me.

MrsTerryPratchett · 10/06/2017 21:20

The rest of the film does pass the test but not by a great deal. There is a secretary and one of the villains is a woman. And a few generic villagers!

And in the end Chris Pine has to be a hero too, which female love interests never seem to be.

It's a good start!