Gender neutral toilets at the Barbican London

[Laurapalmer90]

Has anyone heard about this? Great that women are speaking up. Why can't there be gender neutral toilets AND retain men's and women's?

www.standard.co.uk/news/londoners-diary/londoners-diary-no-toilet-humour-for-samira-ahmed-at-the-barbican-a3507901.html

Late to the party here.

When I'm in the ladies loos I check my make up, adjust clothing, hoik up my tights where necessary and sometimes change tights or clothes if the cubicles are tiny or two floors disgusting. Maybe even hide or have a cry if having a bad time.

If I'm out at a venue, chances are I've had a glass or two.

If the loos are neutral - does that mean anyone can use them? Any man or woman at all?

I can't say I'd feel comfortable in an area where to open to all.

Datun quite. Have to disagree with a woman, belittle her opinions, talk over her, suggest she's unreasonable. Only now they can do it whilst also claiming her and other women who disagree with them on anything (even if it's something one of their own staff have previously agreed with) is a bigot.

“I’m not going anywhere. I’m a trans woman and I am more than happy to piss wherever there’s a girl on the door,” he states

What a cunt

And yes i am aware of the irony

Just comes across as so entitled to me, their wishes must come first, never mind any objections women may have for whatever reason. No desire to understand those objections, engage at all, just forcing their wish on everyone else.

If the loos are neutral - does that mean anyone can use them? Any man or woman at all?

Anyone. Anybody at all.

amy

No desire to understand those objections

Never make the mistake that they don't understand. They understand perfectly. Not only do they not care, it's all part of the frisson.

Datun that's true - I was wrong there. As you say, the objections are actually part of their motivations for doing what they do and many seem to me to revel in it (the writer of that piece being a sadly good example).

See I don't like that.

I may be a fussy pants, I know, but how can you send you little girls into the loos by themselves (for whatever reason) if they are open to everyone? I'm not someone who sees a child molester in every corner but at least if you know it's women only you wouldn't worry about it

What if you're tipsy and nip to the loo? If anyone can use them who's to stop some creep following you in if they think you look vulnerable? Sometimes the loos there are dead empty.

"Perhaps we should move forward with getting rid of gendered loos altogether."

Ah, there speaks a man who has never been flashed, sexually harassed, assaulted or raped. And again, with the term 'move forward' showing that he's liberal and progressive, and anyone still for segregated toilets is backward.

On one hand we are seeing more 'women only' sessions in my local gym and pool, but it's ok for loos to be open to all?

originalbiglymavis those sessions will probably be forced to open up to "trans women" or anyone who "identifies as a woman" at this rate.

Have you ever checked how they define 'women only' at your local gym & pool though, Mavis?

What would actually happen if someone said "I feel like a woman today so you can't exclude me"?

According to Samira this meant the 'ladies' toilets were overcrowded, presumably due to men using them?

She must be wrong, were told constantly that men don't want to do this. Has anyone told her she's mistaken?

Where we are it's usually the religious types who attend the sessions (so I can't see them quietly accepting trans woman) and my friends 88 year old mum who prefers quieter sessions.

I read samira's tweets as her being happy for tw to be there, just not male presenting men. She used 'all women' more than once, rather than just women.

An as pp said, this isn't coming from tw. They want to use sex segregated facilities for validation. With this set up, they are just another dude in line. Its coming from sjw who can't think things through, or just simply don't care.

For every trans person in transactivism, there's probably tens of non trans people pushing their own misogynic agenda. But the trans community don't seem to care.

They've got them in several places in Manchester - they were all individual cubicles, each with its own basin and dryer.

Mavis if the vocal dickheads get their way then full blown becocked and hairy arsed men will have full rights to attend such swimming lessons

This madness needs stopping

According to Samira this meant the 'ladies' toilets were overcrowded, presumably due to men using them?

She must be wrong, were told constantly that men don't want to do this. Has anyone told her she's mistaken?

Well, Samira's posted on this thread so hopefully she'll come back & respond!

i spotted that just after i posted

I wonder if any of the deniers will be along to tell her she imagined it?

(Hi samira!)

It's a shame this thread isn't in aibu or chat, I'd love to hear from the ones who tell us we're hysterical when it's pointed out that this will happen

The problem with individual cubicles is that each one takes up the space of 2 or 3 toilets, and 3 or 4 urinals. so there are fewer toilets with more people trying to use them.
Women are not asking for unisex toilets so why are we subjected to them?

The thing is toilets already are gender neutral. No-one cares if a bloke walks into the mens in a dress, they really don't (apart from those men who would start a fight with anyone over anything), and no-one minds if a woman walks into the ladies in a tuxedo. Toilets are sex segregated, and while it was an honour system, it worked pretty well.

The trouble is people deciding that it's gender, not sex, and that they are special and should be given special treatment. (with a heavy dose of misogyny - men forgetting that women do have different needs, and we don't go into the ladies toilet because we might wear lipstick and a skirt, but because we want privacy from men to do whatever we need to do.

They've got them in several places in Manchester - they were all individual cubicles, each with its own basin and dryer.

Quite a lot of places have always had 'gender neutral' loos - small cafe with just one or two loos, for instance. Or new facilities with large properly designed cubicles, as you mention. They're (IMO) generally OK.

That is a quite different matter to just declaring all existing loos 'gender neutral' - one with urinals, one without.