Thoughts on this book for primary children?

[yellowpostitnote]

I'm sorry, I wasn't sure where to post this!

www.theguardian.com/society/2017/jan/02/book-explaining-gender-diversity-to-primary-school-children-sparks-furore?CMP=fb_gu

I obviously need to read it myself to judge.

I'm divided from the info given. I taught a child who had autism (only diagnosed later) in an sen school. He loved female stereotypical toys, dressing etc. It was confusing for him and school. His parents let him be himself, but he himself believed he was a girl because of his likes. He learnt about trans etc and started thinking he should have operations (when older but at the time he was age 8).

He was seen by specialist people and later as a teen decided he was gay and happy being male.

I would welcome an honest open discussion as, as a primary teacher, I feel I need to know all the POVs.

And I repeat, and take on board, fair opinion of the book is best done after reading it!

I can't help but feel that with something so new - so nebulous - we'd be better off with children's literature that addresses the restrictions of binary gender stereotypes for all children. It sounds obvious but there isn't enough of it out there.

I honestly feel like we are going backwards.

My DD1 (now 30) was fiercely against dolls, dresses and anything pink. She told me she wanted to be a boy. She didn't actively like anything traditionally boyish however, wasn't interested in cars or Lego particularly. I think in her case it was a reaction against her 3 little brothers.

We didn't push it and didn't make a fuss about clothes, except school uniform which was non-negotiable. We continued to offer her opportunities to do things she was interested in, without reference to their being boys things or girls things.

At 14/15 she suddenly started being interested in dressing up and growing her hair and no more was ever said about being a boy. I think, like me at her age, she'd just realised that girls get a bit of a raw deal when it comes to clothes/behaviour etc.

If we'd taken her rejection of being a girl seriously and started her on puberty blockers and surgery what sort of a mess would her head be in now?

We now have a DD2 who is 9. I'm finding that society as a whole and clothing/toys in particular is far more rigidly Girls or Boys than it was in DD1's time. It's these strict expectations of what a boy is or a girl is that is leading to all this "gender" crap.

I've read the book. It's fairly moderate and well balanced, as these things go (as a pp has said, JKP is a thoughtful publisher as a rule), and does make an effort to differentiate between 'girls/boys liking boys'/girls' stuff' and being 'transgender' (pointing out that the former is perfectly standard).

However, I have serious issues with two specific points - the first, that it says 'cisgender' is the "correct" term for someone who 'identifies with their birth gender'; and the second, that it explicitly states that taking hormone blockers in adolescence is entirely harmless and fully reversible. The publishers have told me they will raise the first point with the editors, but are not engaging in dialogue about the second.

I am relatively new to the whole trans debate and I'm still trying to get my head around it so please be gentle. I was a 'tomboy' growing up, didn't like dolls, played football, into video games, hated dresses and dressing up, lived in track suits and trainers, basically rejected most things that were considered 'girly'. I was just allowed to get on with it and be who I was, no one ever questioned my gender. When I was a teen I experimented with make up and clothes a bit but have never and I'm still not into it as much as other women. That's nothing to do with wanting a sex change, it's just who I am. Yet now it seems like if your child doesn't fit the stereotypes then there is something 'wrong' with them and they need to change genders? Bit odd, kids like what they like. Not everything has to be 'for boys' and 'for girls'.

The whole 'assigned gender at birth' thing doesn't sit right with me. When you are born you have either girls bits or boys bits which determine your gender. You're not 'assigned' anything, it's just what you are from a medical stand point, if that makes sense?

Will be reading the thread with interest.

Delete When you are born your bits indicate your sex. This obviously dictates the gender role you are expected to conform to, and the way you are treated in a society that insists on distinct gender roles.

You are right that it is based on genitalia. And the "assigned gender at birth" thing infuriates me as it makes it sound completely random, as if biological sex has nothing to do with it. The idea that it's completely unfair, irrational and damaging to inflict a specific gender role on certain individuals (trans)... rather than unfair, irrational, and damaging to inflict gender roles on anybody.

Meh, what do I know - I'm "cis" apparently. Not calling myself "he", adopting a male name, having surgery and taking testosterone obviously means I'm completely happy with the crappy female gender role I'm expected to live up to...

I was just allowed to get on with it and be who I was, no one ever questioned my gender

Maybe society should let 'kids be kids' - rather than impose rules on what boys and girls are supposed to do. Uniform could be one - as well as hair expectations. If a boy wants to wear a skirt and have long hair, he should be able to - without having to say 'I'm a girl'.

Is it me or is he really not getting it?

I can't quite identify it but I feel he keeps missing a vital point about gender and society.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/jan/13/happy-for-my-daughters-change-gender-fluidity?CMP=fb_gu

I note he states he's happy to be told where he might have been a "transphobic halfwit", but no mention of where he might have been a "misogynistic halfwit"...

I strongly disagree with his assertion that a "tomboy" would now be a trans boy. It gives me a shiver of panic that had I been growing up now, I might have been misinterpreted as trans, instead of turning out to be a gender critical feminist. There was a period of time around when I was about 8 or 9 where I fervently wanted to be a boy. I wanted to play football, cricket and rugby, and there were no options for girls to do so. I wore scuffs trainers instead of patent shoes, had short hair and wouldn't wear a dress. I thought if I hoped enough I might become a boy and be able to do all the things I wanted to. But, I didn't think I was in the wrong body, I just knew that boys could do these things so that's what I wanted to be.

Yes he's fallen into the need to pigeon hole as xx or xy, rather than just b.