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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

football

39 replies

sashh · 02/04/2015 08:33

This morning half watcing BBC (I'm at my dads for a few days he was watching) I heard "Liverpool 2, Birmingham 1, goals scored by ..."

No 'Liverpool Ladies' or mention of 'girls' just a report on a football fixture.

This is the BBC, I nearly choked on my coffee, I'm surew this is the first time I have heard a report like this.

OP posts:
EdithWeston · 02/04/2015 08:36

Girls is only ever ok if they're talking about under 21s.

MQv2 · 02/04/2015 09:34

Tbf to the bbc they're football reporting has gone fairly gender neutral in recent times (not sure if its 100% neutral)

To the point where I have heard people complain or accuse them of click baiting by having stories in gender neutral language like "arsenal striker quits club" and it be a story about the women's team.

So they've been pretty good on that ring (on their website and app at least) for a while

MQv2 · 02/04/2015 09:35

*point

Not ring

ChunkyPickle · 02/04/2015 09:39

The BBC does seem to be having a good push - a much better mix of sport, and there are so many more women in Masterchef this season for example.

cailindana · 02/04/2015 10:08

It's sad that this is a remarkable thing - women being mentioned as actual people rather than the exception to the norm on national news.

I'm glad the BBC are doing it but why did it take this long?

Yops · 02/04/2015 10:56

To be fair to the BBC, the WPL has only recently taken off, so there was little chance to cover women's football in the UK. Are many people even aware of the WPL? The attendances aren't great.

Sirzy · 02/04/2015 11:01

Men's football is by far the most popular sport in this country. No other sport comes close really so of course it gets the most coverage on the sports news.

I do think generally BBC sport seem pretty good at picking up reports on all sports irrespective of the sex of those playing.

Original poster
sashh · 02/04/2015 12:05

To be fair to the BBC, the WPL has only recently taken off, so there was little chance to cover women's football in the UK. Are many people even aware of the WPL? The attendances aren't great.

In an episode of friends Rachel compares her baby kicking to a US soccer player, a woman. Soccer is far from being a major sport but people at least knew they had won and it was well enough known to feature in a non sport context.

OP posts:
Yops · 02/04/2015 13:34

The US women's soccer team has won two world cups, four Olympic golds and is continually ranked in the top 2 teams in the world. Women and girl's soccer is huge in the US from school upwards. It doesn't play second fiddle to the men's game, because is is far more popular from grass roots to professional level. That is why Rachel can make a passing reference to it and everyone gets the joke.

My question was really to UK people. Are many people aware that there is a Women's Premier League in the UK, and does anyone go to the games?

YonicScrewdriver · 02/04/2015 16:51

Do you go, Yops?

Yes, I'm aware of the women's league. I only watch England play international games so I watched the England Wales qualifier and tried to get a ticket to the England Germany qualifier but they were sold out (which is good!)

I expect I will watch some of the World Cup this summer.

loveareadingthanks · 02/04/2015 17:37

I am aware but I don't watch it or follow it. But then I don't watch or follow men's pro football either, it's boring. Only the Sunday team DP plays for (sometimes).

Had a chat in a pub a few months with a very proud Dad whose daughter had just left one pro club for another one.

StillLostAtTheStation · 02/04/2015 19:10

My question was really to UK people. Are many people aware that there is a Women's Premier League in the UK, and does anyone go to the games?

Not aware and wouldn't go to the games.

I'm not particularly interested (actually not at all interested ) in sport beyond the big events like The World Cup and bits (but by no means all) of the Olympics.

I enjoy the 4 weeks of the World Cup as much for the unexpected stuff like Suarez' teeth and Brazil's meltdown. I like the idea that in the final stages millions or maybe billions are all watching it.

I can't imagine being engaged with the World Cup for female players in the same way.

PuffinsAreFictitious · 02/04/2015 19:31

Yes, I'm aware. No, I don't go to games, because I don't enjoy watching soccer. I do enjoy watching rugby, and have played and paid to see games.

sausageeggbacon11 · 02/04/2015 21:35

I am currently watching Notts County vs Arsenal on BT Sport. I know the league and will watch with the boys on TV but live we prefer Rugby especially when the Men are playing beforehand. Fantastic goal for Arsenal just scored that would have the commentators saying how brilliant if it had on been a top male player.

Jessica2point0 · 02/04/2015 23:54

I know there's a women's league but never go to games. I go to my team's men's games about twice each season and always watch if they're on TV.

When there's a big sporting event like the Olympics or Wimbledon I watch men's and women's equally (and pretty obsessively), but if they're separate (like football or rugby world cups) I tend to watch the men's.

I know it's sexist to only watch the men's and I don't know why I do it. Maybe if I make an actual effort to watch the women's games I'll become more interested and after a while it'll become normal.

EBearhug · 03/04/2015 00:05

I'm aware, but don't watch it, but that's because I don't watch football at all.

sausageeggbacon11 · 03/04/2015 07:36

Jessica the primary difference between the two is the explosiveness of speed in the mens game. We play a much more techinically gifted game a bit more slowly apart from the very top of the men's game. Oh and I guess in terms of sheer power of striking the football the men will have the edge but is that because they are stronger or that they play from childhood more so than most girls?

It was nice to see Arsenal bring in an American international who scored the goal I raved about. BT Sport are the only live coverage which means it is only focused on when there are no men's games but I would say the WPL is better technically than say the Conference and a better watch. However I guess there are psychological blocks for people that will only be broken down by TV coverage which will only come with more people watching.... yes one of those horrible vicious circles.

Dotheyfloat · 03/04/2015 10:15

sausageeggbacon11
"We play a much more techinically gifted game a bit more slowly apart from the very top of the men's game."

If the best womens' team was allowed to compete in the male leagues, based purely on technical ability, where do you think they would be placed in the rankings?

YonicScrewdriver · 03/04/2015 10:48

Seriously, DTF, what do you get out of hanging around FWR making snide comments?

Dotheyfloat · 03/04/2015 10:58

Snide? I ask one simple question and Mt. Butthurt starts to rumble; I suspect that rivers of tears shall shortly be flowing from it's peak. Better get my waterproofs on.

YonicScrewdriver · 03/04/2015 11:02

Do give over; you have been snide on several FWR threads so far this morning and many more in the past.

Again, what do you get out of it?

StillLostAtTheStation · 03/04/2015 12:13

We play a much more techinically gifted game a bit more slowly apart from the very top of the men's game

If we set aside DTF's comment as just being stirring (and on the face of it if one ignores his other comments it could be a genuine question) the comment above is a bit of a sweeping generalisation. I get that female players might lack the speed and endurance of male players but this seems to be saying female players are more technically gifted other than the best male players.

Do you mean in coaching you concentrate on pure technique , dribbling, passing skils, placing to the exclusion of speed and stamina , which makes sense. That doesn't make female players more technically "gifted" however.

YonicScrewdriver · 03/04/2015 15:07

I would love to see what the women's game was like after, ooh, 50 years plus of millions of pounds of investment (of course, the men's game being correspondingly allotted significantly smaller annual funding). I assume all the well paid coaches and managers and physios etc make a significant difference, not to mention the talent scouts and funded academies and training facilities.

sausageeggbacon11 · 03/04/2015 17:59

DTF in terms of technical ability WPL would be top of league 2, bottom of league 1 but when you consider the wages even at that level you can't be surprised especially as so many boys try to make careers out of it. I can certainly see Arsenal Ladies beating Hartlepool in terms of technical play however given the men an opportunity to kick women for fun without repercussions nope not going to see that happen. Given the choice of WPL or a League 2 match to watch I know which one would be more my style.

sausageeggbacon11 · 03/04/2015 18:06

Still the issue is that at the lower levels the coaching is limited in the men's game with the majority of teams either being long ball game or a very physical presence. The WPL benefits from coaching staff connected with top clubs. The Doncaster Belles were the number 1 side for many years yet now they are nowhere near the top. Arsenal Ladies have been the top league team for the last couple of years and tactically and technically the game is focused on the strengths... short passes, diagonal balls more in line with the sort of game you would see Arsenal Men play. I have 2 sports mad boys and I would not write this if I hadn't discussed it with them.